CurlTalk

How Racism Works

iris427iris427 Posts: 6,002Registered Users
I just got this email. Discuss.
How Racism Works

What if John McCain were a former president of the Harvard
Law Review? What if Barack Obama finished fifth from the bottom of his
graduating class?

What if McCain were still married to the first woman he
said "I do" to?

What if Obama were the candidate who left his first wife
after she no longer measured up to his standards?

What if Michelle Obama were a wife who not only became
addicted to pain killers, but acquired them illegally through her charitable
organization?

What if Cindy McCain graduated from Harvard?

What if Obama were a member of the Keating 5*?
* The Keating Five were five United States Senators
accused of corruption in 1989, igniting a major political
scandal as part of the larger Savings and Loan crisis of the late
1980s and early 1990s.

What if McCain was a charismatic, eloquent speaker?

If these questions reflected reality, do you really believe
the election numbers would be as close as they are?

This is what racism does. It covers up, rationalizes and
minimizes positive qualities in one candidate and emphasizes negative
qualities in another when there is a color difference.

PS: What if Barack Obama had an unwed, pregnant teenage
daughter....
*******
You are The Boss... which team would you hire?

With America facing historic debt, 2 wars, stumbling
health care, a weakened dollar, all-time high prison population, mortgage
crises, bank foreclosures, etc.

Educational Background:

Obama:
Columbia University - B.A. Political Science with a
Specialization in
Internationa l Relations.
Harvard - Juris Doctor (J.D.) Magna *** Laude

Biden:
University of Delaware - B.A. in History and B.A. in
Political Science.
Syracuse University College of Law - Juris Doctor (J.D.)

vs.

McCain:
United States Naval Academy - Class rank: 894 of 899

Palin:
Hawaii Pacific University - 1 semester
North Idaho College - 2 semesters - general study
University of Idaho - 2 semesters - journalism
Matanuska-Susitna College - 1 semester
University of Idaho - 3 semesters - B.A. in Journalism

Now, which team are you going to hire ?
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Comments

  • A_la_Nap-turalA_la_Nap-tural Posts: 409Registered Users
    Interesting post...

    It's funny how people would like to ignore how big the race factor is in this election and in this country. There have been several flyers put in rotation in NJ & PA. One compared an Obama administration to that of 3rd world countries that are 95% black, ie: Haiti and most countries in Africa. Others report alleged support of Pat Buchanan (someone who has made countless comments similar to Hitler's own beliefs) on issues of Israel (an effort to scare of the Jewish voters, no doubt). Tisk, tisk America. Shame on it all.

    It's long since been time for us to look at our values. Examine why we feel the way we feel. Did we arrive at our opinion after long, meditating thought, or was this theory of an inferior race instilled in us in such a subtle, but effective, way that to distance ourselves from it would almost mean losing our identities?

    The truth is, there is a White America, and a Back America. The White America can never understand my reality of being discriminated against or being made to feel inferior even by my own peers because of a deeply rooted slave mentality. Unless you've (or those who raised you) ascended above the secret ideas of "those people", you may not even realize that racism still exists? Do your research.... Read "The Makings of a Slave" by William Lynch. Focus on the section where he speaks about mental control and how if this is instilled in the black community, it would control them for the next 400 years. Then think about it.... mental control. It doesn't just work in the black community. Why did you say you weren't voting for Obama again? Or do you have a reason... Something to ponder.
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  • NYCurlyGirlyNYCurlyGirly Posts: 1,012Registered Users
    all those "facts" over-simplify McCain as the "bad guy" and Obama as the "good guy". Reality is a LOT more complicated.

    McCain has blamed nobody else for the end of his first marriage, he has taken full responsibility. A lot more was involved than her "not living up to his standards".

    McCain has already been cleared of any wrong-doing with that Keating-Five business.

    And you think there HASN'T been hell raised over Palin's pregnant teenager?! PLEASE.
    "Yo, James, i'm really happy for you, i'm gonna let you finish killing Bella in a minute, but Demetri was one of the best Trackers of ALL time!"

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  • iaraiara Posts: 1,199Registered Users
    all those "facts" over-simplify McCain as the "bad guy" and Obama as the "good guy". Reality is a LOT more complicated.

    McCain has blamed nobody else for the end of his first marriage, he has taken full responsibility. A lot more was involved than her "not living up to his standards".

    McCain has already been cleared of any wrong-doing with that Keating-Five business.

    And you think there HASN'T been hell raised over Palin's pregnant teenager?! PLEASE.
    I think you missed the point...
    You cannot invite someone to your house in the Hamptons and when she arrives, not let her stay. Tacky. Very Tacky. ~ East Village hipster.

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  • legendslegends Posts: 3,073Registered Users
    It's not about anyone being the "good" guy or the "bad" guy, it's about people's reactions and how they differ based on a person's race. Although to be fair, I think in this case it's more of a partisan thing, although race certainly plays a role. If McCain and Palin, with their respective histories and family issues, were Democrats, the Republicans would be screaming "family values" at the top of their lungs (we're talking about a party that wanted to impeach a man over a blow job, here). Likewise, if Obama were republican, they'd bend over backwards to defend him no matter his race.

    Here's another article that I came across a few weeks ago. This is Your Nation on White Privilege.
    Eres o te haces?
  • SpringcurlSpringcurl Posts: 8,002Registered Users
    I liked that so much I'm going to post it here.

    This is Your Nation on White Privilege (Updated)

    September 13, 2008, 2:01 pm
    By Tim Wise
    For those who still can’t grasp the concept of white privilege, or who are looking for some easy-to-understand examples of it, perhaps this list will help.
    White privilege is when you can get pregnant at seventeen like Bristol Palin and everyone is quick to insist that your life and that of your family is a personal matter, and that no one has a right to judge you or your parents, because “every family has challenges,” even as black and Latino families with similar “challenges” are regularly typified as irresponsible, pathological and arbiters of social decay.

    White privilege is when you can call yourself a “****in’ redneck,” like Bristol Palin’s boyfriend does, and talk about how if anyone messes with you, you'll “kick their ****in' ass,” and talk about how you like to “shoot ****” for fun, and still be viewed as a responsible, all-American boy (and a great son-in-law to be) rather than a thug.

    White privilege is when you can attend four different colleges in six years like Sarah Palin did (one of which you basically failed out of, then returned to after making up some coursework at a community college), and no one questions your intelligence or commitment to achievement, whereas a person of color who did this would be viewed as unfit for college, and probably someone who only got in in the first place because of affirmative action.

    White privilege is when you can claim that being mayor of a town smaller than most medium-sized colleges, and then Governor of a state with about the same number of people as the lower fifth of the island of Manhattan, makes you ready to potentially be president, and people don’t all piss on themselves with laughter, while being a black U.S. Senator, two-term state Senator, and constitutional law scholar, means you’re “untested.”


    White privilege is being able to say that you support the words “under God” in the pledge of allegiance because “if it was good enough for the founding fathers, it’s good enough for me,” and not be immediately disqualified from holding office--since, after all, the pledge was written in the late 1800s and the “under God” part wasn’t added until the 1950s--while if you're black and believe in reading accused criminals and terrorists their rights (because the Constitution, which you used to teach at a prestigious law school requires it), you're a dangerous and mushy liberal who isn't fit to safeguard American institutions.


    White privilege is being able to be a gun enthusiast and not make people immediately scared of you.

    White privilege is being able to have a husband who was a member of an extremist political party that wants your state to secede from the Union, and whose motto is “Alaska first,” and no one questions your patriotism or that of your family, while if you're black and your spouse merely fails to come to a 9/11 memorial so she can be home with her kids on the first day of school, people immediately think she’s being disrespectful.


    White privilege is being able to make fun of community organizers and the work they do--like, among other things, fight for the right of women to vote, or for civil rights, or the 8-hour workday, or an end to child labor--and people think you’re being pithy and tough, but if you merely question the experience of a small town mayor and 18-month governor with no foreign policy expertise beyond a class she took in college and the fact that she lives near Russia, you’re somehow being mean, or even sexist.


    White privilege is being able to convince white women who don’t even agree with you on any substantive issue to vote for you and your running mate anyway, because all of a sudden your presence on the ticket has inspired confidence in these same white women, and made them give your party a “second look.”


    White privilege is being able to fire people who didn’t support your political campaigns and not be accused of abusing your power or being a typical politician who engages in favoritism, while being black and merely knowing some folks from the old-line political machines in Chicago means you must be corrupt.


    White privilege is when you can take nearly twenty-four hours to get to a hospital after beginning to leak amniotic fluid, and still be viewed as a great mom whose commitment to her children is unquestionable, and whose "next door neighbor" qualities make her ready to be VP, while if you're a black candidate for president and you let your children be interviewed for a few seconds on TV, you're irresponsibly exploiting them.

    White privilege is being able to give a 36-minute speech in which you talk about lipstick and make fun of your opponent, while laying out no substantive policy positions on any issue at all, and still manage to be considered a legitimate candidate, while a black person who gives an hour speech the week before, in which he lays out specific policy proposals on several issues, is still criticized for being too vague about what he would do if elected.

    White privilege is being able to attend churches over the years whose pastors say that people who voted for John Kerry or merely criticize George W. Bush are going to hell, and that the U.S. is an explicitly Christian nation and the job of Christians is to bring Christian theological principles into government, and who bring in speakers who say the conflict in the Middle East is God’s punishment on Jews for rejecting Jesus, and everyone can still think you’re just a good church-going Christian, but if you’re black and friends with a black pastor who has noted (as have Colin Powell and the U.S. Department of Defense) that terrorist attacks are often the result of U.S. foreign policy and who talks about the history of racism and its effect on black people, you’re an extremist who probably hates America.


    White privilege is not knowing what the Bush Doctrine is when asked by a reporter, and then people get angry at the reporter for asking you such a “trick question,” while being black and merely refusing to give one-word answers to the queries of Bill O’Reilly means you’re dodging the question, or trying to seem overly intellectual and nuanced.


    White privilege is being able to go to a prestigious prep school, then to Yale and Harvard Business School (George W. Bush), and still be seen as an "average guy," while being black, going to a prestigious prep school, then Occidental College, then Columbia, and then Harvard Law, makes you "uppity" and a snob who probably looks down on regular folks.

    White privilege is being able to graduate near the bottom of your college class (McCain), or graduate with a C average from Yale (W.), and that's OK, and you're still cut out to be president, but if you're black and you graduate near the top of your class from Harvard Law, you can't be trusted to make good decisions in office.

    White privilege is being able to dump your first wife after she's disfigured in a car crash so you can take up with a multi-millionaire beauty queen (who you then go on to call the c-word in public) and still be thought of as a man of strong family values, while if you're black and married for nearly 20 years to the same woman, your family is viewed as un-American and your gestures of affection for each other are called "terrorist fist bumps."

    White privilege is when you can develop a pain-killer addiction, having obtained your drug of choice illegally like Cindy McCain, go on to beat that addiction, and everyone praises you for being so strong, while being a black guy who smoked pot a few times in college and never became an addict means people will wonder if perhaps you still get high, and even ask whether or not you may have sold drugs at some point.


    White privilege is being able to sing a song about bombing Iran and still be viewed as a sober and rational statesman, with the maturity to be president, while being black and suggesting that the U.S. should speak with other nations, even when we have disagreements with them, makes you dangerously naive and immature.

    White privilege is being able to say that you hate "gooks" and "will always hate them," and yet, you aren't a racist because, ya know, you were a POW, so you're entitled to your hatred, while being black and noting that black anger about racism is understandable, given the history of your country, makes you a dangerous bigot.

    White privilege is being able to claim your experience as a POW has anything at all to do with your fitness for president, while being black and experiencing racism and an absent father is apparently among the "lesser adversities" faced by other politicians, as Sarah Palin explained in her convention speech.
    And finally, white privilege is the only thing that could possibly allow someone to become president when he has voted with George W. Bush 90 percent of the time, even as unemployment is skyrocketing, people are losing their homes, inflation is rising, and the U.S. is increasingly isolated from world opinion, just because white voters aren’t sure about that whole “change” thing. Ya know, it’s just too vague and ill-defined, unlike, say, four more years of the same, which is very concrete and certain…


    White privilege is, in short, the problem.
    TWINKLES.gifTWINKLES.gifTWINKLES.gif

    Obamacare is not a blueprint for socialism. You're thinking of the New Testament. ~~ John Fugelsang



  • BoomygrrlBoomygrrl Posts: 4,940Registered Users
    You might be right about it being more about political party. However, I must add that the OP made me have to think about my own racism. I don't consider myself a racist. I believe in equality no matter the race or gender. However, the OP did make me stop and think. Had the races been reversed...I really can see myself saying that this black man McCain ranked that low in his class, that the black woman Palin took a long time to finish college, etc. I think I would've looked at their negatives more harshly. I would've seen white Obama as very qualified.
    Instead, I look at McCain's accomplishments and overlook his negatives...I don't ignore Obama's accomplishments but I still somehow question if he's qualified.
    Just so you know, I'm voting for Obama, but it took a lot of soul searching. It took more than this simplistic analysis that I unfortunately would've probably done had the races been reversed.
    Knowing that, and knowing I don't want to be a racist, I'm going to be more aware of how I judge people.
    I am disgusted by my bias. Again, to be clear, I value equality. I don't think white people are superior to black people...but somewhere I guess in my subconscious, maybe in being raised in this society...I don't know...I have to admit I was guilty of what the OP suggested.

    Thanks for posting this. I am all for self-improvement, admitting my mistakes, and learning from it. I know I'm not perfect and have made some errors in judgment. This opens my eyes to how much work I need to do in getting rid of my own insidious racism.

    I've been aware for quite a long time of how sexism is similar. How judgments are often made more harshly against women. HOw there is a higher standard in judging women. And I knew racism still existed and that there are different standards. What I didn't know is that I was implementing the very same double standard.
    That's right, I said it! I wear scrunchies!!

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    :blob8:

    3a/3b
  • TillyMunchyWavesTillyMunchyWaves Posts: 671Registered Users
    Very thought provoking, Springcurl thank you for posting the Wise piece.
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  • ScrappyTamScrappyTam Posts: 470Registered Users
    That was a very thought provoking article SpringCurl. And coming from a very white girl (well, 40yo+ woman), I agreed with it.
    I almost threw my ovaries at him. - Trenell


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  • .patience..patience. Posts: 537Registered Users
    iara wrote: »
    all those "facts" over-simplify McCain as the "bad guy" and Obama as the "good guy". Reality is a LOT more complicated.

    McCain has blamed nobody else for the end of his first marriage, he has taken full responsibility. A lot more was involved than her "not living up to his standards".

    McCain has already been cleared of any wrong-doing with that Keating-Five business.

    And you think there HASN'T been hell raised over Palin's pregnant teenager?! PLEASE.
    I think you missed the point...

    completely and utterly.

    thanks for the posts Iris427 and Springcurl.
  • CurlyDadCurlyDad Banned Posts: 122Banned Users
    McCain -- Service Academy graduate, career Naval Officer, fighter pilot, US Senator with a long and distinguished legislative record.

    Obama -- Stayed in school instead of getting a real job, became a community rabble-rouser and race-baiter before launching undistinguished career in the Illinois legislature followed by a short stint as a US Senator where he racked up the most liberal voting record of all 100, further left than Teddy Kennedy.


    See, we can all play the game.
  • TrenellTrenell Posts: 3,562Registered Users
    ScrappyTam wrote: »
    That was a very thought provoking article SpringCurl. And coming from a very white girl (well, 40yo+ woman), I agreed with it.


    I'm in a siggie!!!!

    On another note. I wish I could log on, and it would all go away.....
  • StephSStephS Posts: 352Registered Users
    Stayed in school instead of getting a real job

    Levi! Is that you???
  • A_la_Nap-turalA_la_Nap-tural Posts: 409Registered Users
    CurlyDad wrote: »
    McCain -- Service Academy graduate, career Naval Officer, fighter pilot, US Senator with a long and distinguished legislative record.

    Obama -- Stayed in school instead of getting a real job, became a community rabble-rouser and race-baiter before launching undistinguished career in the Illinois legislature followed by a short stint as a US Senator where he racked up the most liberal voting record of all 100, further left than Teddy Kennedy.


    See, we can all play the game.


    You scare me CurlyDad... I've seen you in a few forums and on the abortion issue, you seem a little sexist. Now in this forum, you have nothing substantial to say and clearly you didn't understand the meaning of the post. Again, you should check into your values and ask yourself the real reason you're not voting for Obama. If you find that your reasons are legitimate, then fine. But if by chance you discover that you really don't know the reason and you're just pre-disposed to judging him more harshly, then maybe you've taken a page from Mr. William Lynch's book.

    Look up a few threads and check out the article on white privilage. You'd probably never admit it, but it's true. The black man has to fly to get to what the white man can walk to.
    www.thenaturalknowitall.com

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    I'm luvin' my natural self FIRST! :love7:

    "And if you don't want to be down with me, you don't want to pick from my appletree."-Erykah Badu


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  • A_la_Nap-turalA_la_Nap-tural Posts: 409Registered Users
    Boomygrrl wrote: »
    ...Just so you know, I'm voting for Obama, but it took a lot of soul searching. It took more than this simplistic analysis that I unfortunately would've probably done had the races been reversed.
    Knowing that, and knowing I don't want to be a racist, I'm going to be more aware of how I judge people.
    I am disgusted by my bias. Again, to be clear, I value equality. I don't think white people are superior to black people...but somewhere I guess in my subconscious, maybe in being raised in this society...I don't know...I have to admit I was guilty of what the OP suggested.

    ... I am all for self-improvement, admitting my mistakes, and learning from it. I know I'm not perfect and have made some errors in judgment. This opens my eyes to how much work I need to do in getting rid of my own insidious racism.

    I commend you. It takes a very big person to see the flaws in how they were raised and go against what they were taught. Evolution is good! Beautiful, just beautiful :cheers:. We've all got a long way to come, truly. Not just the white race. It's funny, I hear some black people who question Obama just the same. That GOP propaganda goes across the race lines and just becomes self-hatred. I'm not saying that black people must vote for Obama just because he's black. I am saying, however, that the tools that have been in place in this society for hundreds of years are so effective, that we use them on ourselves to bring one another down. No other race has to do it for us... Shame on it all.

    But again, your soul is beautiful. Now if we could have a little "Come to Jesus" talk with CurlyDad. That man is in denial and he loves it!
    www.thenaturalknowitall.com

    www.mixology101.ning.com
    I'm luvin' my natural self FIRST! :love7:

    "And if you don't want to be down with me, you don't want to pick from my appletree."-Erykah Badu


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  • munchkinmunchkin Posts: 2,909Registered Users
    I am going to ask a question. I don't mean for it to sound racist; just a question. I am one of those western Pennsylvanians Murtha called racist. After a lot of soul searching and listening to the candidates and what some of their ideas are, I am voting for Obama. Race was never something I thought about. I am a registered Republican and have voted predominantly Republican for 40 years. This election I knew I had to look at the issues, the candidates and make an independent choice.

    I have been very upset at people like Murtha who think so many of us "whites" are racist and that the reason we won't vote for Obama is because he is black.

    My question is. . . how many black people are voting for Obama because he is black. . . and that being their main reason. That to me is just as racist.
    3b/c
  • NYCurlyGirlyNYCurlyGirly Posts: 1,012Registered Users
    that "white privilege" list is so blown out of proportion I don't know where to start...McCain/Palin have been RIPPED by liberals for most of the stuff on that list, so I guess "white privilige" didn't help them much there...
    "Yo, James, i'm really happy for you, i'm gonna let you finish killing Bella in a minute, but Demetri was one of the best Trackers of ALL time!"

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  • A_la_Nap-turalA_la_Nap-tural Posts: 409Registered Users
    munchkin wrote: »

    My question is. . . how many black people are voting for Obama because he is black. . . and that being their main reason. That to me is just as racist.

    Truly, Munchkin, you'd have to recognize that there is a system of oppression in this country. It's so subtle, yet so effective.

    On the other hand, it's offensive when people suggest that the ONLY reason black people are voting for Obama is because he's black. As if to say, we don't have brains to evaluate the candidates and make a decision from that foundation.

    Consider this...

    No black man has ever gone as far as Obama has in this race. For us, it goes beyond Obama himself. I posted this above, but I'll say it again, truly; the black man has to fly to get to what the white man can walk to. We tell our children, you go to school and work hard and you can be whatever you want. Obama is the solidity of that statement. We don't get too many examples that are all over the news, and there's a sense of pride when you see someone who has experienced the same struggles and prejudices that you have on the ticket. I think to myself, this is what those who have come before me died and fought for. It's finally here, in my lifetime. Now the question: should my sense of pride override my logic in evaluation? Certainly not, but truly I want someone in office who understands me, my struggle, who knows what it's like to be in my skin. I'd trust that person to make decisions that were better for my community than I would someone who's never experienced it first hand, or, someone who is sympathetic to my people because they've done some soul searching and indeed recognize the system... Like Kennedy did.

    Also, to be considered racist, you'd have to deem your own race as superior to the others. That's not my train of thought, but I do like to see someone who looks like me spoken of in a positive light. Just like middle aged white women loved Hillary, because they could see themselves in her. (I'm from AR by the way, but I've been Obama from the jump!)

    In short, I'm not just voting for Obama because he's black, but rather, because he's a representation of the direction I'd like to see this country go in. And furthermore, he's hope to the black race that we so desperately need. I mean think about it... all of our other true black leaders were killed off....
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  • yagottaloveyacurlsyagottaloveyacurls Posts: 5,766Registered Users
    iara wrote: »
    all those "facts" over-simplify McCain as the "bad guy" and Obama as the "good guy". Reality is a LOT more complicated.

    McCain has blamed nobody else for the end of his first marriage, he has taken full responsibility. A lot more was involved than her "not living up to his standards".

    McCain has already been cleared of any wrong-doing with that Keating-Five business.

    And you think there HASN'T been hell raised over Palin's pregnant teenager?! PLEASE.
    I think you missed the point...

    completely.

    Iris, I've thought about this a lot. I'm really glad you posted that. Thank you.
  • BBBB Posts: 475Registered Users
    that "white privilege" list is so blown out of proportion I don't know where to start...McCain/Palin have been RIPPED by liberals for most of the stuff on that list, so I guess "white privilige" didn't help them much there...

    The point is that a person of color with those credentials would be laughed off the ballot and not be on the ticket for either party. Do you honestly think there was a chance in hell Obama would have been the nominee if he had that background?

    There is a quote that says equality means that you can be positively mediocre and still achieve greatness. A woman with Palin's background is put forth as the candidate for the second highest office in the land and Republicans will fight you tooth and nail and say she is qualified. You cdon't think the party could have done better than her? Really?
    A coward is incapable of exhibiting love; it is the prerogative of the brave.

    -Mohandas Gandhi
  • CurlyDadCurlyDad Banned Posts: 122Banned Users
    CurlyDad wrote: »
    McCain -- Service Academy graduate, career Naval Officer, fighter pilot, US Senator with a long and distinguished legislative record.

    Obama -- Stayed in school instead of getting a real job, became a community rabble-rouser and race-baiter before launching undistinguished career in the Illinois legislature followed by a short stint as a US Senator where he racked up the most liberal voting record of all 100, further left than Teddy Kennedy.


    See, we can all play the game.


    You scare me CurlyDad... I've seen you in a few forums and on the abortion issue, you seem a little sexist. Now in this forum, you have nothing substantial to say and clearly you didn't understand the meaning of the post. Again, you should check into your values and ask yourself the real reason you're not voting for Obama. If you find that your reasons are legitimate, then fine. But if by chance you discover that you really don't know the reason and you're just pre-disposed to judging him more harshly, then maybe you've taken a page from Mr. William Lynch's book.

    Look up a few threads and check out the article on white privilage. You'd probably never admit it, but it's true. The black man has to fly to get to what the white man can walk to.

    I scare you? It seems to me you may want to examine your own values rather than direct me to question mine. I find many of the lefty posts here are rooted in uninformed opinion, feel good fantasy about the way the world should be, and outright emotion rather than cold hard assessment of facts and reality.

    I don't give a damn about race -- Obama or otherwise. That's a pre-occupation of the left that most conservatives don't even understand, despite being accused of racism at every turn. My problem with Obama is that his background is rooted in political radicalism, racial grievences politics, and Marxist inspired ideology. His socialist vision for government, economy and society has been tried around the globe and has failed miserably again and again.

    Why people continue to advocate for it demonstrates the lack of understand of economics and history that our politically correct eductation system has foisted on too many generations.

    Your implication that my opposition to Obama is little more than knee-jerk racism is offensive on several levels.

    1) Suggestions of racism are too often used to shut down legitimate debate and attack character when facts aren't available.
    2) You have no reason to suspect race has any place in my thinking, but assume that is what drives it unless I specifiy otherwise. The idea that examination of my values will lead my away from my inherent racist view is despicable and makes me wonder if that is how other liberals view people that don't agree with them. What a sad way to view society.
    3) It's a cop out to suggest it's all about race. There's no reason to believe that, except it absolves you from examining what's really happening.
  • lacunaCoilslacunaCoils Posts: 489Registered Users
    First of all, I have no doubt that some people are racist. However, I am somewhat offended by the "white privilege" article. Why is it saying that white people can get away with anything without being questioned? They ARE being questioned- big time. By all races. I agree that all the things that are listed are wrong- and should definitely be questioned. I don't think that "whites" are privileged in that aspect. Plus I don't think all whites have a "deeply rooted slavery mentality". Most of us were born WAY after slaves were freed and I grew up with blacks being my equals. My best friend is black- we never looked at each other in terms of our skin color.

    I am white and I am an Obama supporter. I am disgusted with some of the racist things that have been said about him. I just don't think black people should feel that they are so oppressed just because they are black. The majority of people have evolved past that.

    I also disagree that "The black man has to fly to get to what the white man can walk to." In some cases, that might be true. But that is a very racist statement. Some white people have it worse than some black people and vice versa. Although I completely do not understand how McCain and Palin got this far in this campaign, I don't think that says that says that ALL white people can walk to where blacks have to fly to.

    Plus, not everything is black and white, we are all human and we all have different perspectives no matter what race we are.
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  • wavezncurlzwavezncurlz Posts: 1,814Registered Users
    munchkin wrote: »
    I am going to ask a question. I don't mean for it to sound racist; just a question. I am one of those western Pennsylvanians Murtha called racist. After a lot of soul searching and listening to the candidates and what some of their ideas are, I am voting for Obama. Race was never something I thought about. I am a registered Republican and have voted predominantly Republican for 40 years. This election I knew I had to look at the issues, the candidates and make an independent choice.

    I have been very upset at people like Murtha who think so many of us "whites" are racist and that the reason we won't vote for Obama is because he is black.

    My question is. . . how many black people are voting for Obama because he is black. . . and that being their main reason. That to me is just as racist.


    I do not paint people with one swath. I look at individuals. That said:

    I do not think your question is racist.

    I do not think it was right for Murtha tosay that whites from your part of PA are racist. Some may be. Others will be open minded. You are a perfect case.

    I am voting for Obama. I am black but I am not voting for him because he's black. I weighed all my options. In the primaries, I didn't make up my mind until the end. I liked Obama and thought it would be nice to see someone in office who looked like me. BUT - I liked Edwards; I liked Biden; I liked the NM governor (name slips); I even liked Hillary until she got nasty.



    I know some blacks who did go for Obama from day one. Again, I don't think they were racist. They saw something in him that they liked and could relate to. My dad is one of them. In his 60's, part of the struggle in the 60-70's, he never thought he'd see the day when a viable black candidate could do this. He's ecstatic and has been a supporter from jump. But he wouldn't have been a supporter if he thought Obama was not smart or unqualified.

    Further, most people won't vote for someone just because they look like them. Women, men, black, white...I never voted for Sharpton and Jesse gets on my nerves. There are black candidates on the ballot here locally that I would never vote for.There are women candidates that scare me. I vote for the right person, for the right time, for me. And this year, that's Obama.
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  • iris427iris427 Posts: 6,002Registered Users
    First of all, I have no doubt that some people are racist. However, I am somewhat offended by the "white privilege" article. Why is it saying that white people can get away with anything without being questioned? They ARE being questioned- big time. By all races. I agree that all the things that are listed are wrong- and should definitely be questioned. I don't think that "whites" are privileged in that aspect. Plus I don't think all whites have a "deeply rooted slavery mentality". Most of us were born WAY after slaves were freed and I grew up with blacks being my equals. My best friend is black- we never looked at each other in terms of our skin color.

    I am white and I am an Obama supporter. I am disgusted with some of the racist things that have been said about him. I just don't think black people should feel that they are so oppressed just because they are black. The majority of people have evolved past that.

    I also disagree that "The black man has to fly to get to what the white man can walk to." In some cases, that might be true. But that is a very racist statement. Some white people have it worse than some black people and vice versa. Although I completely do not understand how McCain and Palin got this far in this campaign, I don't think that says that says that ALL white people can walk to where blacks have to fly to.

    Plus, not everything is black and white, we are all human and we all have different perspectives no matter what race we are.

    You don't see that, all other things being equal, a black person has it harder than a white person in our society? Come on. It's well documented that when two people have the same resumes, for example, the white person is hired more often. A black woman is 4 times as likely to die in childbirth in America than a white woman is--I highly doubt that is just pure biology.
    3027585431_55b6195e50_s.jpg3028374752_0df4d81a1b_s.jpg3028422696_8dcef38baa_s.jpg
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  • A_la_Nap-turalA_la_Nap-tural Posts: 409Registered Users
    .....
    I also disagree that "The black man has to fly to get to what the white man can walk to." In some cases, that might be true. But that is a very racist statement. Some white people have it worse than some black people and vice versa. Although I completely do not understand how McCain and Palin got this far in this campaign, I don't think that says that says that ALL white people can walk to where blacks have to fly to.

    Plus, not everything is black and white, we are all human and we all have different perspectives no matter what race we are.


    I agree with you on the we're all human part. But really, the world isn't as cookie cutter as we'd like. The truth is ugly. Don't take my general statement of "the black man has to fly..." as a racist comment. To my defense, I'm from the south. My family believes that love is love, and when my 2 uncles came home with white women we welcomed them with open arms. Do you think my uncles had the same reception from their white in-laws? No ma'am. Quite the contrary. In fact, my uncles were not accepted or allowed into the homes of their white in-laws until they had children. How could you deny something that is part of you? For them, that was the kicker. I will speak from my own experience though....

    My first name is quite ethnic. I am educated and very efficient in my work. I have nothing but good references. However, when I listed my full name on top of my resume, I didn't get one single call for the jobs I applied for. When I listed my first initial and my full middle name and last name (you wouldn't be able to tell my race), and applied for those same positions, I interviewed and received 3 offers. For some odd reason, my first name scares people and conjures up images of a loud talking, angry black woman. And I'm the opposite....

    CurlyDad, I commend you for making your decisions based on the platform. I encourage more people to do as you've done. But the truth is, a lot won't. No it's not all race based and everything isn't black and white, but you could never know my reality or what I've been subjected to unless you've lived in this skin.
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  • iris427iris427 Posts: 6,002Registered Users
    Boomygrrl wrote: »
    You might be right about it being more about political party. However, I must add that the OP made me have to think about my own racism. I don't consider myself a racist. I believe in equality no matter the race or gender. However, the OP did make me stop and think. Had the races been reversed...I really can see myself saying that this black man McCain ranked that low in his class, that the black woman Palin took a long time to finish college, etc. I think I would've looked at their negatives more harshly. I would've seen white Obama as very qualified.
    Instead, I look at McCain's accomplishments and overlook his negatives...I don't ignore Obama's accomplishments but I still somehow question if he's qualified.
    Just so you know, I'm voting for Obama, but it took a lot of soul searching. It took more than this simplistic analysis that I unfortunately would've probably done had the races been reversed.
    Knowing that, and knowing I don't want to be a racist, I'm going to be more aware of how I judge people.
    I am disgusted by my bias. Again, to be clear, I value equality. I don't think white people are superior to black people...but somewhere I guess in my subconscious, maybe in being raised in this society...I don't know...I have to admit I was guilty of what the OP suggested.

    Thanks for posting this. I am all for self-improvement, admitting my mistakes, and learning from it. I know I'm not perfect and have made some errors in judgment. This opens my eyes to how much work I need to do in getting rid of my own insidious racism.

    I've been aware for quite a long time of how sexism is similar. How judgments are often made more harshly against women. HOw there is a higher standard in judging women. And I knew racism still existed and that there are different standards. What I didn't know is that I was implementing the very same double standard.

    What a great, honest post. Good for you. I think racism is so entrenched in the very fabric of our society that we all internalize it to some degree. I think we all have to look inward sometimes and question our own thoughts and beliefs.
    3027585431_55b6195e50_s.jpg3028374752_0df4d81a1b_s.jpg3028422696_8dcef38baa_s.jpg
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  • munchkinmunchkin Posts: 2,909Registered Users
    Thank you for everyone who responded to my question because you took it the way it was meant. I do know there are many intelligent educated black people who are for Obama for the right reasons; just as there are white people. But I am sure there are just as many black people voting for him because he is black as there are whites voting for McCain because he is white, which definitely is not the reason to support either candidate.
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  • lacunaCoilslacunaCoils Posts: 489Registered Users
    iris427 wrote: »
    First of all, I have no doubt that some people are racist. However, I am somewhat offended by the "white privilege" article. Why is it saying that white people can get away with anything without being questioned? They ARE being questioned- big time. By all races. I agree that all the things that are listed are wrong- and should definitely be questioned. I don't think that "whites" are privileged in that aspect. Plus I don't think all whites have a "deeply rooted slavery mentality". Most of us were born WAY after slaves were freed and I grew up with blacks being my equals. My best friend is black- we never looked at each other in terms of our skin color.

    I am white and I am an Obama supporter. I am disgusted with some of the racist things that have been said about him. I just don't think black people should feel that they are so oppressed just because they are black. The majority of people have evolved past that.

    I also disagree that "The black man has to fly to get to what the white man can walk to." In some cases, that might be true. But that is a very racist statement. Some white people have it worse than some black people and vice versa. Although I completely do not understand how McCain and Palin got this far in this campaign, I don't think that says that says that ALL white people can walk to where blacks have to fly to.

    Plus, not everything is black and white, we are all human and we all have different perspectives no matter what race we are.

    You don't see that, all other things being equal, a black person has it harder than a white person in our society? Come on. It's well documented that when two people have the same resumes, for example, the white person is hired more often. A black woman is 4 times as likely to die in childbirth in America than a white woman is--I highly doubt that is just pure biology.

    Is it well-documented? I thought they would be more likely to hire a minority since some companies have to hire a certain percentage of minorites. If they don't, it's considered discrimination. That's what I've heard, correct me if I am wrong.
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  • lacunaCoilslacunaCoils Posts: 489Registered Users
    .....
    I also disagree that "The black man has to fly to get to what the white man can walk to." In some cases, that might be true. But that is a very racist statement. Some white people have it worse than some black people and vice versa. Although I completely do not understand how McCain and Palin got this far in this campaign, I don't think that says that says that ALL white people can walk to where blacks have to fly to.

    Plus, not everything is black and white, we are all human and we all have different perspectives no matter what race we are.


    I agree with you on the we're all human part. But really, the world isn't as cookie cutter as we'd like. The truth is ugly. Don't take my general statement of "the black man has to fly..." as a racist comment. To my defense, I'm from the south. My family believes that love is love, and when my 2 uncles came home with white women we welcomed them with open arms. Do you think my uncles had the same reception from their white in-laws? No ma'am. Quite the contrary. In fact, my uncles were not accepted or allowed into the homes of their white in-laws until they had children. How could you deny something that is part of you? For them, that was the kicker. I will speak from my own experience though....

    My first name is quite ethnic. I am educated and very efficient in my work. I have nothing but good references. However, when I listed my full name on top of my resume, I didn't get one single call for the jobs I applied for. When I listed my first initial and my full middle name and last name (you wouldn't be able to tell my race), and applied for those same positions, I interviewed and received 3 offers. For some odd reason, my first name scares people and conjures up images of a loud talking, angry black woman. And I'm the opposite....

    CurlyDad, I commend you for making your decisions based on the platform. I encourage more people to do as you've done. But the truth is, a lot won't. No it's not all race based and everything isn't black and white, but you could never know my reality or what I've been subjected to unless you've lived in this skin.

    It may be that I don't understand so much because I come from the north. That's terrible about your uncles not being accepted and the fact that you weren't getting interviews because of your name. I really do hate to admit that the world is so ugly. If only we could all live peacefully with love and compassion for all...but yeah, sad but true, only some of us are capable of that.
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    pw: curlygirl

    peacelove.jpg
  • iaraiara Posts: 1,199Registered Users
    iris427 wrote: »
    First of all, I have no doubt that some people are racist. However, I am somewhat offended by the "white privilege" article. Why is it saying that white people can get away with anything without being questioned? They ARE being questioned- big time. By all races. I agree that all the things that are listed are wrong- and should definitely be questioned. I don't think that "whites" are privileged in that aspect. Plus I don't think all whites have a "deeply rooted slavery mentality". Most of us were born WAY after slaves were freed and I grew up with blacks being my equals. My best friend is black- we never looked at each other in terms of our skin color.

    I am white and I am an Obama supporter. I am disgusted with some of the racist things that have been said about him. I just don't think black people should feel that they are so oppressed just because they are black. The majority of people have evolved past that.

    I also disagree that "The black man has to fly to get to what the white man can walk to." In some cases, that might be true. But that is a very racist statement. Some white people have it worse than some black people and vice versa. Although I completely do not understand how McCain and Palin got this far in this campaign, I don't think that says that says that ALL white people can walk to where blacks have to fly to.

    Plus, not everything is black and white, we are all human and we all have different perspectives no matter what race we are.

    You don't see that, all other things being equal, a black person has it harder than a white person in our society? Come on. It's well documented that when two people have the same resumes, for example, the white person is hired more often. A black woman is 4 times as likely to die in childbirth in America than a white woman is--I highly doubt that is just pure biology.

    Is it well-documented? I thought they would be more likely to hire a minority since some companies have to hire a certain percentage of minorites. If they don't, it's considered discrimination. That's what I've heard, correct me if I am wrong.
    There are tons of scientific and unscientific studies.

    To the bolded: That is a misconception. There is no quota system. If you are talking about affirmative action, white women benefit the most. That is also documented.

    :
    :
    :
    An aside: I have not been in this country long and I can see the inequality (I live in the north). It amazes me that people who lived here all their lives cannot see the inequality and disparity between ethnic groups or walk around with misconceptions about how their country works.
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  • A_la_Nap-turalA_la_Nap-tural Posts: 409Registered Users
    munchkin wrote: »
    Thank you for everyone who responded to my question because you took it the way it was meant. I do know there are many intelligent educated black people who are for Obama for the right reasons; just as there are white people. But I am sure there are just as many black people voting for him because he is black as there are whites voting for McCain because he is white, which definitely is not the reason to support either candidate.

    Oh Munchkin, you're no racist. I think you're far from it. You're very open and accommodating to others views. Beautiful soul...

    I agree with the bolded... What can you do? Unfortunately ignorance isn't illegal! Truly, it's up to each individual to start within themselves and be an example for others, since we can't force people to expand their minds. I think a lot of society's opinions of race stems from a hurt past and long practiced traditions. Whatever the reason, it's not an excuse to hold on to it, and refusing to recognize ones biased views only perpetuates the problem. It certainly goes across all races. No one race can blamelessly point fingers at another...
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