Product application questions

wavy in neenahwavy in neenah Posts: 113Registered Users
I don't remember where I read this last night, but someone said don't finger comb your hair in order to cut down on frizz after cleaning your hair. OK, so how are we supposed to get our product evenly distributed if we don't finger comb?

Like I said last night, as soon as I start to scrunch, the several large clumps will separate into lots of stringy pieces. I get a lot of frizz too. It's like all of these hairs start climbing their way up the other hair shafts so I've got all these little loopies sticking out of the main spirals. (They're really loose spirals. Big S's with a 3" span from beginning of one S to the next that twist clockwise, so I really don't know if I should be considered a 3a).

I'm not sure I'm explaining that correctly. I'll need to get some pictures put up.

I remember something in the Jessicurl videos about using a paper towel to scrunch. I did that last night, but I didn't know the reason for doing it, so I didn't know what to look for.

I feel like a big retard asking all these questions.
Hair type: Currently 2c/3amii. Modified CG since 05/25/2008. Length is roughly 2" past my collar bone.
'Poo: Dr. Bronner's lemon 'poo bar once a week.
Co-Wash: Suave Naturals coconut condish. Freeman SeaKelp Moisturizing Condish.
Styling: Flax seed gel, Tresemme Bouncy Curls, Hask Spray-It Curly, Tresemme Curl Locking Spray.
Towel: Fake chamois from the auto dept. Gets out so much water that my hair is starting to spiral instead of water weight pulling them all out into waves.
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Comments

  • SunshineGrrlSunshineGrrl Posts: 3,823Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    In order to keep my clumps, I apply product to soaking wet hair and only scrunch the product in, don't rake or finger-comb it in. And I scrunch it for a long time to make sure the product is distributed evenly. Helps keep it clumpy and keep the stringlets away. I have them today because I tried applying product by sections...bad idea. It's now back in hairpins.

  • whatsercurlwhatsercurl Posts: 4,049Registered Users
    Depending on the day, I will either finger comb or use the scrunching method sunshinegrrl described. I find if my hair is soaking wet when I apply my product I can rake through and get no frizz. Certain types of curlies also curl more with less hair in the clumps.

    I scrunch regardless of whether I finger comb or not. However, I scrunch more if I don't finger comb to ensure my product is well distributed. When my hair is well conditioned and really wet, I have no frizz issue from scrunching. I don't blot or remove any water from my hair before applying product though either.
    Current Products: CJ Products: CF, DF, CT, SG, AFG, CIAB AND CK is back!
    Current Experiment: S&C by D

    Curl Fix and Daily Fix are my HGs :love4:


    Sulphate and cone free since July 2007

    wavy/curly fine texture/medium porosity/medium-low density

    http://public.fotki.com/whatsercurl/

    PW: wavycurly

    Seek not to change the world. Rather seek to change your mind about the world.
  • wavy in neenahwavy in neenah Posts: 113Registered Users
    Thanks girls.

    I guess I'll just have to keep trying everyone's advice and experimenting. I tried it soaking wet last night and it did the same thing. :banghead:

    I guess I'm currently meant to have teeny weenie waves/spirals. I have to say, it beats having to constantly comb it and then watch it get stringy, wondering what the hell is wrong with my hair and why won't it stay smooth like other people's.
    Hair type: Currently 2c/3amii. Modified CG since 05/25/2008. Length is roughly 2" past my collar bone.
    'Poo: Dr. Bronner's lemon 'poo bar once a week.
    Co-Wash: Suave Naturals coconut condish. Freeman SeaKelp Moisturizing Condish.
    Styling: Flax seed gel, Tresemme Bouncy Curls, Hask Spray-It Curly, Tresemme Curl Locking Spray.
    Towel: Fake chamois from the auto dept. Gets out so much water that my hair is starting to spiral instead of water weight pulling them all out into waves.
  • SunshineGrrlSunshineGrrl Posts: 3,823Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Thanks girls.

    I guess I'll just have to keep trying everyone's advice and experimenting. I tried it soaking wet last night and it did the same thing. :banghead:

    I guess I'm currently meant to have teeny weenie waves/spirals. I have to say, it beats having to constantly comb it and then watch it get stringy, wondering what the hell is wrong with my hair and why won't it stay smooth like other people's.

    Something that worked for me in the beginning was applying product by sections to make sure I got them all, then respraying the hair to where it's almost dripping with a mixture of water, condish and a spot of gel. Helped my hair reclump together, but I knew I had even distribution of products, which was a problem. Then I scrunched using a towel (Flour sack or microfiber or t-shirt) trying to get out as much water as possible before plopping.

    I'm starting to thing plopping might not be a good thing for me. I'm still experimenting with that, though.

  • wavy in neenahwavy in neenah Posts: 113Registered Users
    Something that worked for me in the beginning was applying product by sections to make sure I got them all, then respraying the hair to where it's almost dripping with a mixture of water, condish and a spot of gel.

    I was thinking of doing that. Do you have a problem with all the water weight pulling the curl out? The more I scrunch to get out water, the more it separates and gets frizzy. Could it be that it needs more moisture?
    I'm starting to thing plopping might not be a good thing for me. I'm still experimenting with that, though.

    I'm torn on plopping too. I'm not seeing any real benefit from it.

    I have one of those old bonnet dryers, the kind with the shower-cappy thing, not the huge plastic helmet you sit under. Picked it up for $3. That's working really well for drying. I get to do some Entertainment Weekly reading at the same time. :D
    Hair type: Currently 2c/3amii. Modified CG since 05/25/2008. Length is roughly 2" past my collar bone.
    'Poo: Dr. Bronner's lemon 'poo bar once a week.
    Co-Wash: Suave Naturals coconut condish. Freeman SeaKelp Moisturizing Condish.
    Styling: Flax seed gel, Tresemme Bouncy Curls, Hask Spray-It Curly, Tresemme Curl Locking Spray.
    Towel: Fake chamois from the auto dept. Gets out so much water that my hair is starting to spiral instead of water weight pulling them all out into waves.
  • SunshineGrrlSunshineGrrl Posts: 3,823Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Because I'm rewetting it, it seems to help the curls clump and spring back. I make sure when I'm scrunching the wet hair with the towel, I fold it gently into the towel and scrunch it like I do without a towel. Helps tremendously. And I don't scrunch it with the towel a whole bunch, just scrunch with the hair caught in the towel a couple times (Like I'm pumping the scrunch when wet), then release it to do a new section with a new section of towel.

    Have you tried the scrunch-n-pump method? Don't remember who created it (or thought to call it that), but they swear by the clumps and I tend to agree. The thought process is that once your hair has all the product, take a section of the hair upside down (hair has to be squishy sounding for it to work right, I personally think) and scrunch up the hair into the palm of your hand. Scrunch 8 times (might be 6, can't remember the magic number), then release and do a new section. It really does work even though it seems like it's over-touching your hair. Because it's sopping wet, it helps a lot.

    I tried the bonnet dryer, though I'm totally jealous you got it for $3. I spent $40 because my sister-in-law lost my mom's old, old, old one she used in high school. It didn't do much, but I'm willing to give it another try.

  • wavy in neenahwavy in neenah Posts: 113Registered Users
    I tried the bonnet dryer, though I'm totally jealous you got it for $3.

    I'm a major thrift store junkie.
    Hair type: Currently 2c/3amii. Modified CG since 05/25/2008. Length is roughly 2" past my collar bone.
    'Poo: Dr. Bronner's lemon 'poo bar once a week.
    Co-Wash: Suave Naturals coconut condish. Freeman SeaKelp Moisturizing Condish.
    Styling: Flax seed gel, Tresemme Bouncy Curls, Hask Spray-It Curly, Tresemme Curl Locking Spray.
    Towel: Fake chamois from the auto dept. Gets out so much water that my hair is starting to spiral instead of water weight pulling them all out into waves.
  • KitaraKitara Posts: 1,224Registered Users
    I've tried everything; scrunching, smoothing, combing, unicorn, apply products super wet, applying products mostly dry, etc. etc. etc.

    Nothing gives me big clumps. So, I have determined that I am meant to have thin stringy curls. I mean, it doesn't look that bad when it's all dry, but they are definitely not clumpy. Most are about toothpick size (or a tad bigger) when wet.

    I plop when my hair is pretty wet and it seems to work better for me. Then I'm able to brush my teeth, get dressed, etc. without messing up the curls. After I take it out then I scrunch out the water and add a wee bit more gel. I tend to get the least amount of frizz that way (but my hair is in NO way non-frizzy.)
  • curlysue21curlysue21 Posts: 5,219Registered Users
    I posted something similar to this not long ago. I've been experimenting too seeing as I just went CG about a month ago. I find that what gives me the most clumps is using a curl creme and plopping. I have a hard time with halo and crown frizz and your plight sounds similar to mine. After plopping I apply gel by scrunching which does break up the clumps but I try to gather groups of hair together and scrunch to try to keep them clumped. It also helps for me to apply stuff to very wet hair also and when I do I rake it in from top to bottom to see it's distributed evenly. Play with products too if you can afford it- certain products work for some people and not others.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]2b/c, medium/high porosity, medium/coarse texture
    Current HG: Kinky Curly errythang, GVPCB, LALSG

    "I will never be the woman with perfect hair, who can wear white and not spill on it."

  • wavy in neenahwavy in neenah Posts: 113Registered Users
    Kitara, are we hair twins? Today I have curls as thin as your toothpicks to as thick as a skinny Crayola marker. Thin in the front and thicker in the back.

    I was reading the frizz classification thread last night. I have in the curl frizz and/or product application frizz from ionic products. So now I have to avoid polyquats too? Gah!

    Today I mixed up a concoction of ime juice, distilled water, AVG, and Softee Indian Hemp goop and sprayed that all over while it was wet, scrunched, clipped, and plopped. I'm hoping the watered down AVG gives it hold but not so much crunch while the Softee gives it some softness and shine, and ibraidhair says lime juice helps the curl formation. I had to nuke it for a few seconds to melt the oily goop and then shook it like crazy to mix. I'm still in my plop T-shirt so I don't know how it's doing.

    During my "I can't stand this constantly stringy, tangled hair, I'm going to lock it up" phase, I bought the kit from Nappy & Happy but never went through with it. I'm going to check the ingredients on the Dew and Growth products to see if they're CG friendly. They aren't on the bottle, so it's off to the website..... Damn, the Dew is her "special secret formula."

    Curlysue, I have a bunch of products right now that I've been playing with. None of them I don't like, but none of them have given me nice clumps either. I still have to get to Sally to get some Biotera curl cream. I have LOOB right now; is that similar at all?
    Hair type: Currently 2c/3amii. Modified CG since 05/25/2008. Length is roughly 2" past my collar bone.
    'Poo: Dr. Bronner's lemon 'poo bar once a week.
    Co-Wash: Suave Naturals coconut condish. Freeman SeaKelp Moisturizing Condish.
    Styling: Flax seed gel, Tresemme Bouncy Curls, Hask Spray-It Curly, Tresemme Curl Locking Spray.
    Towel: Fake chamois from the auto dept. Gets out so much water that my hair is starting to spiral instead of water weight pulling them all out into waves.
  • curlysue21curlysue21 Posts: 5,219Registered Users
    I still have to get to Sally to get some Biotera curl cream. I have LOOB right now; is that similar at all?


    I get great results from the Biotera curl creme as well as LOOB. I'd definately try it especially seeing as it's not too expensive.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]2b/c, medium/high porosity, medium/coarse texture
    Current HG: Kinky Curly errythang, GVPCB, LALSG

    "I will never be the woman with perfect hair, who can wear white and not spill on it."

  • KitaraKitara Posts: 1,224Registered Users
    I was thinking about you today so I tried to get my "best" clumps so you could see it wet just for comparison's sake.

    Note the frizz? It's like my hair repels from itself. I don't ever not have this. It's less or more depending on the day, but never gone. And it gets worse as it dries.
    IMG_9263.jpg

    And these are my "best" clumps. Usually it's less clumpy.
    IMG_9262.jpg

    ETA: I forgot I took this picture a few weeks ago. It's a "big" clump and you can see how the little hairs just frizz out. upset.gif

    Jun01-004.jpg
  • curlysue21curlysue21 Posts: 5,219Registered Users
    Kitara wrote: »
    I was thinking about you today so I tried to get my "best" clumps so you could see it wet just for comparison's sake.

    Note the frizz? It's like my hair repels from itself. I don't ever not have this. It's less or more depending on the day, but never gone. And it gets worse as it dries.
    IMG_9263.jpg

    And these are my "best" clumps. Usually it's less clumpy.
    IMG_9262.jpg

    That's how mine comes out too...EXACTLY.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]2b/c, medium/high porosity, medium/coarse texture
    Current HG: Kinky Curly errythang, GVPCB, LALSG

    "I will never be the woman with perfect hair, who can wear white and not spill on it."

  • wavy in neenahwavy in neenah Posts: 113Registered Users
    Yep, that's what mine does.

    My hair feels sooooo amazing right now. No crunch whatsoever, not greasy feeling, significantly less frizz (but it's still there. Let's just say it helps our hair look fuller, shall we?), and super, super, suuuuuper soft. That combination of products I came up with actually worked. Whod've guessed?
    Hair type: Currently 2c/3amii. Modified CG since 05/25/2008. Length is roughly 2" past my collar bone.
    'Poo: Dr. Bronner's lemon 'poo bar once a week.
    Co-Wash: Suave Naturals coconut condish. Freeman SeaKelp Moisturizing Condish.
    Styling: Flax seed gel, Tresemme Bouncy Curls, Hask Spray-It Curly, Tresemme Curl Locking Spray.
    Towel: Fake chamois from the auto dept. Gets out so much water that my hair is starting to spiral instead of water weight pulling them all out into waves.
  • wavy in neenahwavy in neenah Posts: 113Registered Users
    Or maybe that's how my hair is with no product in it. Hmmm. Either way, it feels really good.

    I scrunched some LOOB into just the ends and spritzed on some Fructis XXXL (one water-soluble 'cone) for a little more spring.

    This could be a temporary winning combo.
    Hair type: Currently 2c/3amii. Modified CG since 05/25/2008. Length is roughly 2" past my collar bone.
    'Poo: Dr. Bronner's lemon 'poo bar once a week.
    Co-Wash: Suave Naturals coconut condish. Freeman SeaKelp Moisturizing Condish.
    Styling: Flax seed gel, Tresemme Bouncy Curls, Hask Spray-It Curly, Tresemme Curl Locking Spray.
    Towel: Fake chamois from the auto dept. Gets out so much water that my hair is starting to spiral instead of water weight pulling them all out into waves.
  • SunshineGrrlSunshineGrrl Posts: 3,823Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Hooray! You found something that works! Well, for the short-term, at least. Hoping it works for the long-term!

  • alyssa_kalyssa_k Posts: 51Registered Users
    Kitara wrote: »
    I was thinking about you today so I tried to get my "best" clumps so you could see it wet just for comparison's sake.

    Note the frizz? It's like my hair repels from itself. I don't ever not have this. It's less or more depending on the day, but never gone. And it gets worse as it dries.
    IMG_9263.jpg

    And these are my "best" clumps. Usually it's less clumpy.
    IMG_9262.jpg

    ETA: I forgot I took this picture a few weeks ago. It's a "big" clump and you can see how the little hairs just frizz out. upset.gif

    Jun01-004.jpg

    Wow, these could be pictures of my hair. Here is an example of mine, though it has improved quite a bit recently (no pictures yet).
    frizzzz.jpg
    2cCiii
    Using: Testing new stuff :)
    :toothy6:
  • wavy in neenahwavy in neenah Posts: 113Registered Users
    I feel like I'm part of a stringy, frizzy sisterhood. :D
    Hair type: Currently 2c/3amii. Modified CG since 05/25/2008. Length is roughly 2" past my collar bone.
    'Poo: Dr. Bronner's lemon 'poo bar once a week.
    Co-Wash: Suave Naturals coconut condish. Freeman SeaKelp Moisturizing Condish.
    Styling: Flax seed gel, Tresemme Bouncy Curls, Hask Spray-It Curly, Tresemme Curl Locking Spray.
    Towel: Fake chamois from the auto dept. Gets out so much water that my hair is starting to spiral instead of water weight pulling them all out into waves.
  • KitaraKitara Posts: 1,224Registered Users
    And we rock! woot.gif
  • wavy in neenahwavy in neenah Posts: 113Registered Users
    I read a thread last week that mentioned ionically-charged products cause frizz problems for some people. (I think that's what it was). Anyway, polyquats fall into that category. My two fave products at the moment don't have any in them. LOOB, however, does.

    I put LOOB in while my hair was still soaking wet and looked pretty smooth. It INSTANTLY caused my hair to start frizzing and separating into strings. I rinsed it out right away and the problem disappeared. I put in the other products instead, and my hair stayed smooth and clumped.
    Hair type: Currently 2c/3amii. Modified CG since 05/25/2008. Length is roughly 2" past my collar bone.
    'Poo: Dr. Bronner's lemon 'poo bar once a week.
    Co-Wash: Suave Naturals coconut condish. Freeman SeaKelp Moisturizing Condish.
    Styling: Flax seed gel, Tresemme Bouncy Curls, Hask Spray-It Curly, Tresemme Curl Locking Spray.
    Towel: Fake chamois from the auto dept. Gets out so much water that my hair is starting to spiral instead of water weight pulling them all out into waves.
  • swirlygirlswirlygirl Posts: 606Registered Users
    I read a thread last week that mentioned ionically-charged products cause frizz problems for some people. (I think that's what it was). Anyway, polyquats fall into that category. My two fave products at the moment don't have any in them.

    What other ingredients are ionically-charged? I think this is an issue for me!
    2B ~ Lovin' it short again!
    Aloe 80 Shampoo & Conditioner, Shea Butter & Aveda Control Paste
    Fotki PW: swirlygirl
    Updated 7/13/08


  • lauralblauralb Posts: 19Registered Users
    I've been wondering the same thing -- would love to know!

    (Also: I was at Whole Foods earlier this evening and saw that Giovanni now has a line of "ionic" styling products -- in grey bottles. Not sure what they do or if they're trying to address this issue?)
    Fia system: 2c/3a, F, ii. (fine, delicate curls/waves that need encouragement or they'll fall flat)

    **After years of mostly straightening, now I'm trying to find a routine that will encourage the curl, add volume, give some light hold and not weigh it down. Suggestions always welcome!
  • aaa00aaaa00a Posts: 284Registered Users
    Wow! My hair has always been like that! I've posted about it before.

    Anyways, I know my hair does it no matter what I put in my hair. Even if I just rinse my hair in water and don't put product. It's still super frizzy when wet, and it gets a whole lot worse as it dries. So, I'm not entirely convinced it would be an ingredient, but maybe?
    Wavy, dry, protein sensitive, coarse, highly overly porus, very low elasticity, medium-thick density, very prone to split ends
    Avoids: Sulphates, Silicones, Protein, Mineral oil, Petroleum, Polyquaternium, Sodium/Magnesium, Heat
    Mod-CG since June 2007
  • LoloDSMLoloDSM Posts: 3,778Registered Users
    For crying out loud. I didn't take chemistry after my 11 grade class in high school, and now I am an expert on silicones, sulfates, magnesium sulfate, proteins, and polyquats? :scratch: This is insane. The look on my stylist's face when I mentioned all of this at my last appointment spoke volumes about how crazy this is. And now I have to worry about my ionic dryer??? Agh! I don't even know if I can call myself naturally curly when it takes 27+ (not really) products to get there.

    *Sigh* Perhaps I should just ditch all products and just use water, air, and the blood of a freshly killed chicken. Who am I kidding? I probably have a water and air sensitivity. :-|

    Thus concludes today's rant. As you were.
    Loose botticelli curls and waves
    No silicones/no sulfates since March 2008
  • KitaraKitara Posts: 1,224Registered Users
    Blood is ionically charged.

    Just an FYI.






    giggle.gif j/k
  • lauralblauralb Posts: 19Registered Users
    Lauralbi4 wrote: »
    I've been wondering the same thing -- would love to know!

    (Also: I was at Whole Foods earlier this evening and saw that Giovanni now has a line of "ionic" styling products -- in grey bottles. Not sure what they do or if they're trying to address this issue?)


    So, I had to look these up...they are supposedly magnetically charged (does that mean ionic? So confused). http://www.giovannicosmetics.com/Mline/data/index.htm

    And the science behind them is crazy:

    http://www.giovannicosmetics.com/Mline/data/ML_exphome.php

    If anyone has time to sift through that, I think it has some good info about what kind of charge is in your hair.

    (Personally, i'll be checking for chicken blood next time I'm at Whole Foods... :wink:)
    Fia system: 2c/3a, F, ii. (fine, delicate curls/waves that need encouragement or they'll fall flat)

    **After years of mostly straightening, now I'm trying to find a routine that will encourage the curl, add volume, give some light hold and not weigh it down. Suggestions always welcome!
  • lauralblauralb Posts: 19Registered Users
    .
    Fia system: 2c/3a, F, ii. (fine, delicate curls/waves that need encouragement or they'll fall flat)

    **After years of mostly straightening, now I'm trying to find a routine that will encourage the curl, add volume, give some light hold and not weigh it down. Suggestions always welcome!
  • wavy in neenahwavy in neenah Posts: 113Registered Users
    LoloDSM wrote: »
    For crying out loud. I didn't take chemistry after my 11 grade class in high school, and now I am an expert on silicones, sulfates, magnesium sulfate, proteins, and polyquats? :scratch: This is insane. The look on my stylist's face when I mentioned all of this at my last appointment spoke volumes about how crazy this is. And now I have to worry about my ionic dryer??? Agh! I don't even know if I can call myself naturally curly when it takes 27+ (not really) products to get there.

    *Sigh* Perhaps I should just ditch all products and just use water, air, and the blood of a freshly killed chicken. Who am I kidding? I probably have a water and air sensitivity. :-|

    Thus concludes today's rant. As you were.

    No, the ionic dryer is safe. The thread was in the General forum, but damned if I can remember the name of the thread. It was one of the exceptionally long ones.

    I've been getting great results with flax seed gel and Hask Spray It Curly.

    I picked up BCC yesterday on everyone's recommendations. It has polyquats. My hair turned out stringy and limp this morning even when paired with a strong hold gel. Guess it's not a product for me. :(
    Hair type: Currently 2c/3amii. Modified CG since 05/25/2008. Length is roughly 2" past my collar bone.
    'Poo: Dr. Bronner's lemon 'poo bar once a week.
    Co-Wash: Suave Naturals coconut condish. Freeman SeaKelp Moisturizing Condish.
    Styling: Flax seed gel, Tresemme Bouncy Curls, Hask Spray-It Curly, Tresemme Curl Locking Spray.
    Towel: Fake chamois from the auto dept. Gets out so much water that my hair is starting to spiral instead of water weight pulling them all out into waves.
  • wavy in neenahwavy in neenah Posts: 113Registered Users
    Hair type: Currently 2c/3amii. Modified CG since 05/25/2008. Length is roughly 2" past my collar bone.
    'Poo: Dr. Bronner's lemon 'poo bar once a week.
    Co-Wash: Suave Naturals coconut condish. Freeman SeaKelp Moisturizing Condish.
    Styling: Flax seed gel, Tresemme Bouncy Curls, Hask Spray-It Curly, Tresemme Curl Locking Spray.
    Towel: Fake chamois from the auto dept. Gets out so much water that my hair is starting to spiral instead of water weight pulling them all out into waves.
  • missy60missy60 Posts: 351Registered Users
    Someone was asking about using paper towels. The purpose is to use them to dry your hair because regular towel can cause frizz for some people.

    I will post my routine in case it helps any one because my hair can be really stringy also. I wash my hair upside down in the bath. While bent over I rinse out my conditioner and rake my gel thru soaking wet hair. I then cup my hair and squeeze out some of the water. I then do the accordian thing for a few mins. I can see the clumps forming again. I take a t-shirt and still doing the accordian thing just push the curls to my head with the t-shirt. I then turn over and take a little more gel and sort of zig zag thru the curls to get the stray hairs to bond back with the clumps. If I have stray curls I just pick that clump up and twist it to form together. I check it with a mirror to make sure I dont have any stray straight looking hairs, because they will dry that way. I then put a few clips in and diffuse the top part where the clips are and leave the bottom to air dry.

    My hair is getting longer and I have tried plopping a few times I will say it works alot better now that my hair is getting longer. I cant apply any product after plopping on drier hair because handling breaks up my curls and causes frizz around them. I can maybe spray on a little gel but I usually dont.

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