CurlTalk

Alternative to popular product

HeatherNicoleHeatherNicole Posts: 1,316Registered Users
Many of us use a very popular curl enhancing product. Since the ingredients are all natural and she started this business out of her home, why can't we recreate it for ourselves as a more cost effective alternative?
Thick coarse 3c/4a prone to dryness.
Staples
Aphogee 2 Step treatment
Generic Biolage Conditioning Balm
Tigi MM Conditioner
Creme of Nature Shampoo for dry hair
KCCC
Denman D3
Giovanni Direct Leave-in
SheaMoisture Leave-in
/home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fpublic.fotki.com%2FMsHeatherNicole%2F" class="Popup

"Make it work!"- Tim Gunn
«1

Comments

  • missmoniemissmonie Posts: 920Registered Users
    I'd love to know how to make it. I LOVE this product...and yes....$35 for a styler and leave-in is expensive. I'm curious to see how long the jar i have lasts me though.
    4a: Combo of tight coils and waves; Last relaxer - 11/05 (LC - 4/07) - /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fpublic.fotki.com%2Fmissmonie%2F" class="Popup - updates as of Mar '09

    Products: Trader Joe's condish * Giovanni Direct Leave in * Fantasia Gel or KCCC for curl definition * Karen's Body Beautiful Hair Cream as moisturizer

    comic-p.jpg
  • natashamcknatashamck Posts: 434Registered Users
    I'm sooooo down for trying to come up with a cheaper alternative...I've been restricting myself to using it only on the weekends to try to make my jar last as long as possible.
    If we can make our own version I'd be using it everyday :blob7:

    Here are the ingredients:
    botanical infusion of water, horsetail, chamomile, nettle and marshmallow, organic aloe vera juice, agave nectar extract, tocopheryl acetate (vitamin e), pectic, citric acid, potassium sorbate and natural fragrance


    What's the purpose of pectic (acid?) What about potassium sorbate? We can probably leave that out since its just a preservative...

    I'll do some more online research on the other ingredients.
    mostly coarse texture, normal porosity... I think?
    HG: Generic Matrix Biolage, KCCC, KCKT, CBSS WSHP
  • SuburbanbushbabeSuburbanbushbabe Posts: 15,402Registered Users
    That's pectin, and it's a very common ingredient in jams and jellies. It's what gives the product it's gelly like consistency.

    agave nectar extract and potassium sorbate may be difficult to find. Agave nectar is all around but I've never seen the extract.
    My blog - /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fsuburbanbushbabe.wordpress.com%2F" class="Popup
    My FOTKI - /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fwhatsnew.fotki.com%2Fsuburbanbushbabe%2F" class="Popup
    comic-p.jpg

    Playing with my hair is a hobby. Fluffy, fine natural 4a. Goal= Healthy, beautiful hair that retains its length.
    Hear that crash? It's me falling off the CG wagon.
  • HeatherNicoleHeatherNicole Posts: 1,316Registered Users
    Some other hair product uses the agave nectar extract...I want to say it's in some BB product. It's got to be somehow available though-- I mean she found it. Maybe she extracted it from regular agave nectar through some simple process. IDK. All I know is that this is not readily available (for me, personally) and I'm thinking it could be made cheaper in the long run. With tax this ish is 30 bucks, that's just 8 bucks cheaper than Miss Jessie's (another over priced product)--and I'd never spend the money on it.
    Thick coarse 3c/4a prone to dryness.
    Staples
    Aphogee 2 Step treatment
    Generic Biolage Conditioning Balm
    Tigi MM Conditioner
    Creme of Nature Shampoo for dry hair
    KCCC
    Denman D3
    Giovanni Direct Leave-in
    SheaMoisture Leave-in
    /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fpublic.fotki.com%2FMsHeatherNicole%2F" class="Popup

    "Make it work!"- Tim Gunn
  • LKahmilLKahmil Posts: 239Registered Users
    It sounds like a pretty good idea... as long as you guys don't sell it.. I mean.. it is not like you all or we all are trying to put them out of business.
  • HeatherNicoleHeatherNicole Posts: 1,316Registered Users
    I won't sell it, I don't guess. lol. Not to anyone on here, anyways. And if I did it'd be like half the price...but that's not the point. I'm totally joshin'. For real, though, we could just PM the recipe with the measurements and process to those interested. I don't want to ruin what she's built.
    Thick coarse 3c/4a prone to dryness.
    Staples
    Aphogee 2 Step treatment
    Generic Biolage Conditioning Balm
    Tigi MM Conditioner
    Creme of Nature Shampoo for dry hair
    KCCC
    Denman D3
    Giovanni Direct Leave-in
    SheaMoisture Leave-in
    /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fpublic.fotki.com%2FMsHeatherNicole%2F" class="Popup

    "Make it work!"- Tim Gunn
  • Riot CrrlRiot Crrl Posts: 3,135Registered Users
    Agave extract can be found at brewing supply stores, and possibly vitamin/health food stores. It's used as a homebrew adjunct and low-glycemic-index sweetener. Since no one is going to be eating it, or fermenting it, it may be acceptable to get by with something like high-fructose corn syrup for way cheaper.

    Potassium sorbate is also used for wine bottling, brew supply may have it.
  • SuburbanbushbabeSuburbanbushbabe Posts: 15,402Registered Users
    Riot Crrl wrote: »
    Agave extract can be found at brewing supply stores, and possibly vitamin/health food stores. It's used as a homebrew adjunct and low-glycemic-index sweetener. Since no one is going to be eating it, or fermenting it, it may be acceptable to get by with something like high-fructose corn syrup for way cheaper.

    Potassium sorbate is also used for wine bottling, brew supply may have it.

    Is the extract different than the nectar? I use the nectar for sweetening. Never seen the extract.
    My blog - /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fsuburbanbushbabe.wordpress.com%2F" class="Popup
    My FOTKI - /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fwhatsnew.fotki.com%2Fsuburbanbushbabe%2F" class="Popup
    comic-p.jpg

    Playing with my hair is a hobby. Fluffy, fine natural 4a. Goal= Healthy, beautiful hair that retains its length.
    Hear that crash? It's me falling off the CG wagon.
  • midgimidgi Posts: 2,409Registered Users
    Is the extract different than the nectar? I use the nectar for sweetening. Never seen the extract.

    No.. they are one in the same. Agave "extract" and agave "nectar" are used interchangeably even though they are describing the same thing. I refer to it as Nectar just because it sounds cooler.
    I just want to do what I want to do when I want to do it.
  • HeatherNicoleHeatherNicole Posts: 1,316Registered Users
    No no, you can find agave nectar no problem. What SBB is asking since the ingredients say "Agave Nectar extract" is is there a difference between the extract and just the agave nectar? I can't find agave nectar extract when I google it.

    Thank Riot as usual you're a big help.
    Thick coarse 3c/4a prone to dryness.
    Staples
    Aphogee 2 Step treatment
    Generic Biolage Conditioning Balm
    Tigi MM Conditioner
    Creme of Nature Shampoo for dry hair
    KCCC
    Denman D3
    Giovanni Direct Leave-in
    SheaMoisture Leave-in
    /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fpublic.fotki.com%2FMsHeatherNicole%2F" class="Popup

    "Make it work!"- Tim Gunn
  • Riot CrrlRiot Crrl Posts: 3,135Registered Users
    Riot Crrl wrote: »
    Agave extract can be found at brewing supply stores, and possibly vitamin/health food stores. It's used as a homebrew adjunct and low-glycemic-index sweetener. Since no one is going to be eating it, or fermenting it, it may be acceptable to get by with something like high-fructose corn syrup for way cheaper.

    Potassium sorbate is also used for wine bottling, brew supply may have it.

    Is the extract different than the nectar? I use the nectar for sweetening. Never seen the extract.

    Googling a little, I think that's correct. They seem to me to be basically both fructose and interchangeable. When I first read "nectar" I was thinking like those mango papaya juice cans, lol. Kerns? But since nectar is already just the extracted sugar, I don't know what they'd further extract from it. The ingredient is listed as "agave nectar extract," and nectar and extract are both extracted sugar products.

    I found people using them interchangably in home brew recipes, and those can end badly when the wrong amount or type of sugar is used. Not just "bad hair day" bad, but "exploding glass bottles flyin' atcha" bad.
  • midgimidgi Posts: 2,409Registered Users
    Ooooo I see what you're saying BUT...

    Maybe the makers of Kinky-Curly put "nectar" next to "extract" because people sometimes refer to Agave nectar as Agave extract.

    Agave nectar IS Agave extract.

    "Agave nectar extract" doesn't make sense.
    I just want to do what I want to do when I want to do it.
  • LKahmilLKahmil Posts: 239Registered Users
    I won't sell it, I don't guess. lol. Not to anyone on here, anyways. And if I did it'd be like half the price...but that's not the point. I'm totally joshin'. For real, though, we could just PM the recipe with the measurements and process to those interested. I don't want to ruin what she's built.

    Well.. I am all for it.. I mean this would be like certain Sally's products.. There is always a generic brand and this would be it... Good Luck! Let me know if I can help out in anyway...
  • HeatherNicoleHeatherNicole Posts: 1,316Registered Users
    Oh no Riot! We don't want glass bottles flying anydamnwhere. So have we determined that the nectar and extract are the same and [buylink=http://www.curlmart.com/Kinky-Curly-Curling-Custard-p-778.html?utm_source=naturallycurly.com&utm_medium=text-link&utm_content=curltalk-post-text&utm_campaign=kinkycurly-curling-custard]kccc[/buylink] is just being extra by adding extract?

    Thanks Midgi, I was unfamiliar with that whole process so it makes much more sense now.

    LKhamil- Yes exactly.
    Thick coarse 3c/4a prone to dryness.
    Staples
    Aphogee 2 Step treatment
    Generic Biolage Conditioning Balm
    Tigi MM Conditioner
    Creme of Nature Shampoo for dry hair
    KCCC
    Denman D3
    Giovanni Direct Leave-in
    SheaMoisture Leave-in
    /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fpublic.fotki.com%2FMsHeatherNicole%2F" class="Popup

    "Make it work!"- Tim Gunn
  • Riot CrrlRiot Crrl Posts: 3,135Registered Users
    Yeah, I think nectar and extract are the same in this case. Not if we were talking about mango for instance, but agave, yes.

    There will be no exploding containers unless fermentation occurs. :) That may be in part what the vitamin E, citric acid, and potassium sorbate are for. I don't think it's too good for hair after it's fermented anyway. (Please no one remind me of the Shampoo On Tap from the 70s, LOL)
  • heavengirl410heavengirl410 Posts: 821Registered Users
    There was a recipe for Jojoba Jelly. This thread mentions it but the link to the actual recipe doesn't work. http://www.naturallycurly.com/curltalk/showthread.php?t=15314&highlight=jojoba+jelly

    I think this girl used to post here, and she has the recipe and a tuturial posted on YouTube. Maybe this will help, and give some ideas on how to make it. /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3Dl5X3Vr1Xn1Q" class="Popup
  • HeatherNicoleHeatherNicole Posts: 1,316Registered Users
    Awesome, and just to be on the safe side, we'll use plastic lol.
    Thick coarse 3c/4a prone to dryness.
    Staples
    Aphogee 2 Step treatment
    Generic Biolage Conditioning Balm
    Tigi MM Conditioner
    Creme of Nature Shampoo for dry hair
    KCCC
    Denman D3
    Giovanni Direct Leave-in
    SheaMoisture Leave-in
    /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fpublic.fotki.com%2FMsHeatherNicole%2F" class="Popup

    "Make it work!"- Tim Gunn
  • spiral-ncspiral-nc Posts: 716Registered Users
    Watching this thread with interest...

    Btw, I bought some agave nectar at Whole Foods a while back. I used it on my hair by adding a few drops to some VO5 as a leave in. It had a hold similar to honey, but a bit more flexible. I haven't had time to do any further experiments.
    spirals, kinks, s-shapes and coils.

    /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fpublic.fotki.com%2FSpiral" class="Popup

    H is for Henna and Healthy Hair!
    Use only the PURE STUFF
  • HeatherNicoleHeatherNicole Posts: 1,316Registered Users
    SPIRAL!!! Where the hell have you been? We have missed you and your glorious hair.
    Thick coarse 3c/4a prone to dryness.
    Staples
    Aphogee 2 Step treatment
    Generic Biolage Conditioning Balm
    Tigi MM Conditioner
    Creme of Nature Shampoo for dry hair
    KCCC
    Denman D3
    Giovanni Direct Leave-in
    SheaMoisture Leave-in
    /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fpublic.fotki.com%2FMsHeatherNicole%2F" class="Popup

    "Make it work!"- Tim Gunn
  • HeatherNicoleHeatherNicole Posts: 1,316Registered Users
    Here are the ingredients:
    botanical infusion of water, horsetail, chamomile, nettle and marshmallow, organic aloe vera juice, agave nectar extract, tocopheryl acetate (vitamin e), pectic, citric acid, potassium sorbate and natural fragrance

    Alright so according to the law of ingredients, the first listed ingredient occupies the majority of the product, followed by the 2nd, third, and so on. So, if we follow that rule, that means we've got.

    1. Botanical fusion of water, horsetail, chamomile, nettle, and marshmallow (I'm assuming they mean the root, right? I've heard of marshmallow root, but not just friggin marshmallow). Can someone please say how to make a botanical infusion? lol. I know it involves boiling, straining, and sometimes a little sitting. So thinking in terms of producing 8oz. 3 to 4oz.

    2. Organic Aloe Vera Juice- Check! we gots that under control. lol. 1-2oz (however 5 oz is created)

    3. Agave Nectar- 1- 1.5 oz. We know how sticky honey is and how you don't need alot of it to feel its effects.

    4. vit E 1 oz.

    4. Pectic- Idk the consistency of this, but I'm assuming it's a powder (is this in jello? It sounds really familiar). I'm also assuming we'd probably only need maybe a teaspoon b/c [buylink=http://www.curlmart.com/Kinky-Curly-Curling-Custard-p-778.html?utm_source=naturallycurly.com&utm_medium=text-link&utm_content=curltalk-post-text&utm_campaign=kinkycurly-curling-custard]kccc[/buylink] isn't that thick. oz

    5. Remaining space dedicated to citric acid, K sorbate, and fragrance.

    How's that sound?
    Thick coarse 3c/4a prone to dryness.
    Staples
    Aphogee 2 Step treatment
    Generic Biolage Conditioning Balm
    Tigi MM Conditioner
    Creme of Nature Shampoo for dry hair
    KCCC
    Denman D3
    Giovanni Direct Leave-in
    SheaMoisture Leave-in
    /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fpublic.fotki.com%2FMsHeatherNicole%2F" class="Popup

    "Make it work!"- Tim Gunn
  • blackhoney112blackhoney112 Posts: 126Registered Users
    Co-signing to this idea because ppl are charging wayyy to much for products....

    Your recipe sounds pretty spot on! Btw the botancial fusion is exactly what you described basically boiling those herbs in water.

    I will be watching this thread, I love making my own products so I'll give whatever support I can! :toothy7:
    3c/4a
    Transitioning
    Following C&G method
    Fav products: Kenra MC, Misskey 10en1, VO5 moisturemilks, ACV rinses, Rhassoul clay & WGO
    pw: Romeo
    My hair album
  • kathymackkathymack Posts: 9,999Registered Users
    I find this thread intriguing, hope you don't mind if I butt in!

    When I do a botanical infusion, I take all of the herbs and put them in a muslin tea bag (I get them at the health food store or online.) That way--no straining. I use distilled water and make sure to add a preservative. I do a lot of the infusion and use it as a base for any of my "experiments." Saves time and energy--you don't always have to start from scratch.
    3a (Corkicelli), highlighted, fine, low porosity
    SE PA

    HGs: Anything Sevi; Curly Kinks Satin Roots, Curlycue ReNew and Coil Jam; homemade FSG and okra gel; soap bars; UFD Curly Magic; Botanical Spirits Jellies, CJ Repair Me, Aloe Fix
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • HeatherNicoleHeatherNicole Posts: 1,316Registered Users
    gracias kathy!
    Thick coarse 3c/4a prone to dryness.
    Staples
    Aphogee 2 Step treatment
    Generic Biolage Conditioning Balm
    Tigi MM Conditioner
    Creme of Nature Shampoo for dry hair
    KCCC
    Denman D3
    Giovanni Direct Leave-in
    SheaMoisture Leave-in
    /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fpublic.fotki.com%2FMsHeatherNicole%2F" class="Popup

    "Make it work!"- Tim Gunn
  • NaddyNaddy Posts: 57Registered Users
    a
    BC - 21/07/08
    Transitioning since 23/08/07
    Coarse 4a
  • crocketpcrocketp Posts: 30Registered Users
    this is a great idea...i was just thinking the same thing myself! I just did the big chop a week ago and have already gone through almost my whole bottle of KT. The KC is o.k. I usethat sparingly, but it's the KT that I need.:icescream:
    :wink:4a I think! Love curls whipped cream, KCKT, & KCCC! BC 4/14/08 /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Ffotki.com%2Fprissy1" class="Popup
    password: curly
  • SuburbanbushbabeSuburbanbushbabe Posts: 15,402Registered Users
    okay, so who's making it :blob7:
    My blog - /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fsuburbanbushbabe.wordpress.com%2F" class="Popup
    My FOTKI - /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fwhatsnew.fotki.com%2Fsuburbanbushbabe%2F" class="Popup
    comic-p.jpg

    Playing with my hair is a hobby. Fluffy, fine natural 4a. Goal= Healthy, beautiful hair that retains its length.
    Hear that crash? It's me falling off the CG wagon.
  • Riot CrrlRiot Crrl Posts: 3,135Registered Users
    Alas, I am a terrible candidate for cooking and testing on, as I have never had the real [thing] :oops:
  • HeatherNicoleHeatherNicole Posts: 1,316Registered Users
    I'm going to ask that anyone who has referenced the name of this product remove it. I can't change the title of this thread, but for people who choose to continue the pursuit of their own version of this product. Please keep in mind:

    You cannot sell this or market it as your own creation and if you do you risk hurting someone's business that they have worked hard to build and legal repercussions.

    My intention for starting this thread was simply as a more cost effective alternative-- not to hinder anyone's profits. I am a graduate student that supports herself. I know that quite a few of us are, or we're just tight on money. Personally, this was a temporary solution to the problem. I know what I create might never be as good as the original, but it was an avenue I was willing to explore until my situation changed.

    I would like to mention I was NOT threatened legally or in any shape or form.

    But in short if someone wants to continue this and share their results, please do not share your process on the main forum or refer to this popular product by name.
    Thick coarse 3c/4a prone to dryness.
    Staples
    Aphogee 2 Step treatment
    Generic Biolage Conditioning Balm
    Tigi MM Conditioner
    Creme of Nature Shampoo for dry hair
    KCCC
    Denman D3
    Giovanni Direct Leave-in
    SheaMoisture Leave-in
    /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fpublic.fotki.com%2FMsHeatherNicole%2F" class="Popup

    "Make it work!"- Tim Gunn
  • Riot CrrlRiot Crrl Posts: 3,135Registered Users
    Changed mine. I don't want to steal formulas or sell stuff, I just think it would be cool if we could cook our own stuff at home.
  • NaddyNaddy Posts: 57Registered Users
    Making your own stuff is fun.
    BC - 21/07/08
    Transitioning since 23/08/07
    Coarse 4a
«1