confused about sulfates

JuicyTube

I was at acne.org forums and read that you should avoid sodium lauryl sulfate in cleansers and such. Knowing that the sls and als sulfates are super harsh on hair, I questioned why some of the reccommended cleansers had sulfates as a main ingredient. An educated veteran member said that soldium lauryl sulfate was harsh, but sodium laureth sulfate is a "gentler" surfectant. What to believe on skincare? :?

tinabcurly

I think everyone's skin is so different that what's gentle for some is not for others. Oily skin may think something is gentle but dry skin will think it's way harsh.

I'm a trial & error kinda girl-- gentleness for me depends on the concentration of the detergent & what else is in it. Usually, one use is enough to tell me if it's gentle or not. If not, I return it drugstores & supermarkets usually take stuff back no questions asked.

Cetaphil has sodium lauryl sulfate, the most harsh detergent ever made, but it is in such a low concentration & has no fragrance & so many other conditioning ingreds that it's the most gentle cleanser I've ever used.

In the winter I have normal/combination skin & in the summer I have oily skin- not prone to major breakouts anymore-Accutane survivor here

My favs over the years from in order of gentleness:

*Cetaphil Gentle Cleanser- s. lauryl sulfate as the 5th ingredient-- extremely gentle--I can use this anywhere on my body (even down below) any time & it doesn't burn the eyes. It is so gentle that it doesn't remove oil & makeup without really scrubbing with a wash cloth so I only use this in the AM. *pHisoderm Deep Cleaning for sensitive skin (discontinued)- s laureth sulfate as the 4 ingred- gentle-- can use morning & night. *Cetaphil Daily Facial Cleanser- normal to oily skin- s laureth sulfate is 6th ingred-- gentle-- can use AM & PM. can get a little dried out so I try to only use in PM during the winter. *pHisoderm Deep Cleaning for normal to dry skin (discontinued)- has s. laureth sulfate as 2nd ingred- kinda gentle- can use AM/PM during the summer when I'm oily or at night in the winter when I wear foundation. *Peter Thomas Roth Anti-Aging Cleansing Gel (this is the $$ one we talked about in another thread)- Ammonium Lauryl Sulfate is 2nd ingred- kinda gentle- only can use a few times a week & at night when I've worn foundation.

Whew- sorry for the long post. HTH. I know it can be so confusing finding something that cleans well but doesn't blast your skin off at the same time. Unfortunately, there's no hard fast rule.

RedCatWaves

My skin has never been smoother or clearer since I STOPPED using detergent (SLS) cleansers and high PH soaps. I'll never go back to using detergents either on my face or my hair.

JuicyTube

thankyou soo much both! =]

JerseyCurl

RedCatWaves wrote:

My skin has never been smoother or clearer since I STOPPED using detergent (SLS) cleansers and high PH soaps. I'll never go back to using detergents either on my face or my hair.

I have been leaning in this direction as well. What do you use to cleanse your face? Thanks.

RedCatWaves

There aren't a whole lot of choices when one decides to stop using detergent facial cleansers. The most obvious choice is soap. But any solid soap is going to have a PH of probably 10 or 12. That's very alkaline and just as damaging to the skin's acid mantle as detergents are. Some people use oils. They're an OK choice if you're very dry, but a lot of them don't cleanse or rinse very well and can clog pores for those prone to breakouts. Cold creams generally contain a whole lot of junk, from detergents to waxes to irritating menthols...most of them are big old mess for me.

I use a castille liquid soap that has had it's PH lowered with citric acid so that it's neutral. I have to order it online, because the big cosmetic industry just doesn't have anything detergent-free available in the typical drug store.

http://dianayvonne.com/product/CSC23_4

Eilonwy

I've found that there are a lot of face cleansers at the drugstore that are sulfate free. You just have to get out there and take some time reading the ingredients.

By the way, you should take what you read on Acne.org with an ocean of salt. Their trademark regimen is mostly okay, although a little silly (putting moisturizer on top of a ton of benzoyl peroxide won't do much, and it really doesn't matter how hard you rub soap on your face with your fingers :roll:). Their message boards, though, are absolutely insane and often recommend dangerous "remedies" like intentionally overdosing in vitamin A. Even the suggestions that aren't likely to result in liver damage aren't based on anything particularly factual.

JuicyTube

Eilonwy wrote:

I've found that there are a lot of face cleansers at the drugstore that are sulfate free. You just have to get out there and take some time reading the ingredients.

By the way, you should take what you read on Acne.org with an ocean of salt. Their trademark regimen is mostly okay, although a little silly (putting moisturizer on top of a ton of benzoyl peroxide won't do much, and it really doesn't matter how hard you rub soap on your face with your fingers :roll:). Their message boards, though, are absolutely insane and often recommend dangerous "remedies" like intentionally overdosing in vitamin A. Even the suggestions that aren't likely to result in liver damage aren't based on anything particularly factual.

:shock: And I take those boards like I do this place.. Where did the overdose incident come from?! I havent read anything too insane. Of course, I only browse on so many topics.

Eilonwy

blush wrote:

:shock: And I take those boards like I do this place.. Where did the overdose incident come from?! I havent read anything too insane. Of course, I only browse on so many topics.

Woah, I'm sorry if I made it sound like someone had died! No one has, but they still advocate ridiculous, risky behavior. My dad's a doctor, and based on that upbringing, this sort of thing is a pet peeve of mine.

What I was referring to was the "alternative" to Accutane I've seen on that site. Taking Accutane, the anti-acne drug, basically means going through a controlled and monitored, short-term overdose of synthetic vitamin A. People who take Accutane get their toxicity levels monitored every couple of weeks or so, and they gradually build up to a dose. Accutane has a lot of exaggerated bad hype surrounding it, and most of the site's members seem to think that they will be driven to suicide if they get near a bottle. The few times I read the boards, I noticed a lot of people saying that you can avoid the "side effects" of Accutane by overdosing on vitamin A for a few months, with no medical supervision! So aside from the questionable claim of causing suicide, you're still up for liver toxicity and uncommon side effects that are more likely to happen without supervision, like joints drying out. I haven't heard of any of that happening to members of that site, but the whole idea of Teh Internets telling people "what they (people with medical degrees) don't want you to know"...drives me insane.

A lot of the members also recommend taking massive amounts of other vitamins, like vitamin C because of its antioxidant properties. They also use prescription medications for purposes that they weren't prescribed for, or in unorthodox ways (like breaking capsules and turning the contents into a facial mask). And then there are the people who advocate things that just aren't going to help, like avoiding chocolate.

The basic premise of the Acne.org Regimen is the same as one of the benefits of CG: If you put gentler chemicals on your skin, your skin will eventually produce less oil and show fewer symptoms of irritation. I'm currently trying out another version of this, the OCM. But nearly all the information I've seen on the message boards is just not true. I'm sure it's very useful if you use common sense (and I'm sure that you do). But the site still drives me crazy. Anyway, I'm just another non-doctor on the internet, so you shouldn't take my word for it

RedCatWaves

I've found that there are a lot of face cleansers at the drugstore that are sulfate free.

Are they soap? Those are the only cleansers I can think of that would be sulfate free, and soap has it's own issues.

Gemini13

Aveeno's Skin Brightening cleanser for sensitive skin (I think that's what it's called) is sulfate-free. I've been using it for a few months, it's worked well so far...

RedCatWaves

I could only find Aveeno's Skin Brightening SCRUB cleanser online, which has SLS's in it. Is there another one?

Kaia

I use the Aveeno Calming Foaming cleanser, and I really like it. It's sulfate free. http://www.aveeno.com/detailAction.do?id=1424

RedCatWaves

OK...found the Aveeno products and looked at the ingredients. Both contain cocomide betaine and disodium something-or-other, which are detergents. I don't want any detergents on my face, not just sulfate detergents.

Gemini13

Bailey422 wrote:

I use the Aveeno Calming Foaming cleanser, and I really like it. It's sulfate free. http://www.aveeno.com/detailAction.do?id=1424

Ah yes, that's the one! It's worked well for me this winter, I started breaking out less pretty much as soon as I started using it, and I haven't even needed to use a moisturizer (usually I need one in the wintertime). I don't know if it's going to work as well for me in the summer though... we'll see.

echokitten

I use this
http://store.darisimall.com/63933.html
or this
http://www.clearlynaturalsoaps.com/

glycerin soaps like these tend to have no SLS or animal byprods. They are less drying b/c of the glycerines, and are truly noncomedogenic due to the lack of animal byprods or stripping SLS or betaines.

JuicyTube

Eilonwy wrote:

blush wrote:

:shock: And I take those boards like I do this place.. Where did the overdose incident come from?! I havent read anything too insane. Of course, I only browse on so many topics.

Woah, I'm sorry if I made it sound like someone had died! No one has, but they still advocate ridiculous, risky behavior. My dad's a doctor, and based on that upbringing, this sort of thing is a pet peeve of mine.

What I was referring to was the "alternative" to Accutane I've seen on that site. Taking Accutane, the anti-acne drug, basically means going through a controlled and monitored, short-term overdose of synthetic vitamin A. People who take Accutane get their toxicity levels monitored every couple of weeks or so, and they gradually build up to a dose. Accutane has a lot of exaggerated bad hype surrounding it, and most of the site's members seem to think that they will be driven to suicide if they get near a bottle. The few times I read the boards, I noticed a lot of people saying that you can avoid the "side effects" of Accutane by overdosing on vitamin A for a few months, with no medical supervision! So aside from the questionable claim of causing suicide, you're still up for liver toxicity and uncommon side effects that are more likely to happen without supervision, like joints drying out. I haven't heard of any of that happening to members of that site, but the whole idea of Teh Internets telling people "what they (people with medical degrees) don't want you to know"...drives me insane.

A lot of the members also recommend taking massive amounts of other vitamins, like vitamin C because of its antioxidant properties. They also use prescription medications for purposes that they weren't prescribed for, or in unorthodox ways (like breaking capsules and turning the contents into a facial mask). And then there are the people who advocate things that just aren't going to help, like avoiding chocolate.

The basic premise of the Acne.org Regimen is the same as one of the benefits of CG: If you put gentler chemicals on your skin, your skin will eventually produce less oil and show fewer symptoms of irritation. I'm currently trying out another version of this, the OCM. But nearly all the information I've seen on the message boards is just not true. I'm sure it's very useful if you use common sense (and I'm sure that you do). But the site still drives me crazy. Anyway, I'm just another non-doctor on the internet, so you shouldn't take my word for it

Sorry, I was just suprised! Thanks for the explanation.. I would never get into that type of overdose stuff. =]

JuicyTube

I'd love to try some different cleansers, but the dermatologist reccommended to use Cetaphil with my acne medications because he likes it. Personally, I don't find it any better than anything else.. :oops: Do you think it would be ok to go against his words and try other things? I'm really interested in the Aveeno too.

RedCatWaves

I use this
http://store.darisimall.com/63933.html
or this
http://www.clearlynaturalsoaps.com/

glycerin soaps like these tend to have no SLS or animal byprods. They are less drying b/c of the glycerines, and are truly noncomedogenic due to the lack of animal byprods or stripping SLS or betaines.

I LOVE glycerine soap, and have been using Pears and Clearly Natural on my body for years. But I don't like the residue glycerine leaves behind on my face.

meriellyn

I use African Black Soap with shea butter, unscented goat milk/glycerin soap (it's called Unsmelly Goat, hehe), and Cetaphil for oily skin on my face, depending on the day. For body I use one of the first two, Dr. Bronners, or a baby foam I found that's mostly water, aloe and one of the coco- betadine cleansers in it. I wash my chest and upper back with whatever I use on my face.

My skin doesn't like harsh cleansers.