Beginner! Dry, Colorado Climate; Low Porosity (?), Medium Density, Short, 2b Hair

steadycetti

OOPS. How do I move this to the Low Porosity section? I didn't mean to post here!

Hi, new friends! 

I think I have read every article and watched every YouTube video out there. I am saturated with too much (sometimes conflicting!) advice, products, and methods. I am HATING my hair; I've been trying to be "natural" for one month. Here's the struggle bus:

Biggest problem:
- I feel absolutely stumped on HOW to apply my products (the order, the method, damp/dry, scrunch, AYE) or know what products I need. Raking seems to seriously break up my waves. Plopping squishes the back of my hair flat. Trying to apply products post-shower, after blotting and scrunching a bit.

Smaller issues: 
- Can't seem to figure out HG products
- Frizz, frizz, FRIZZ!! (It frizzes almost right out of the shower - even when I blot with my t-shirt! I do diffuse slightly - I can't seem to wait ALL.DAY for my hair to dry)
- Haven't deep conditioned yet...looks like I need to try. Recommendations?

Currently trying or using:
Camille Rose Sweet Ginger Cleansing Rinse
Shea Moisture Low Porosity Conditioner
(Trying) Kinky Kurly Knot Today (Perhaps too thick?)
(Trying) Camille Rose Hair Milk (Also thick)
(Trying...and I think hating, actually) Shea Moisture Curl Enhancing Smoothie

My HG used to be Redken Aerate Mousse after I washed and conditioned (with regular, non-CG products)

If you live in a dry climate and/or have low porosity, wavy hair, I'd love to know!

Therese1

Sorry you're having a tough time. Regarding being stumped about the order in which to apply product, the usual order is leave-in, curl enhancer/soft-hold product (if using), and then hard-hold gel. Generally, the leave-in goes first and the gel goes last, and other products go in between.

Most of us get the best results by applying products to hair that is pretty wet. I like to squeeze my hair after washing/conditioning so that it is not dripping wet, and I usually use a flour sack towel (so, like a t-shirt) to blot the ends of my hair so water doesn't drip everywhere. Then I start applying my product. 

Since you're having trouble with raking, I would try the praying hands method. You put product on your palms, rub them together, and then sandwich your hair between the palms, running the palms down the hair. This usually doesn't destroy clumps too badly. After you have applied all your products, you can scrunch your hair to get the wave bouncier, since the praying hands will flatten the hair somewhat. If you still find that your clumps have been destroyed, just take some water in your palms and scrunch water back into your hair (even after you're done applying product; it's OK). Adding water back into the hair helps re-form clumps.

If you live in a dry climate, you probably need to deep condition. I live in the Midwest, with really dry winters, and I need to deep condition once a week during that time of year. You don't need a special deep conditioner; you can use your rinse-out conditioner. Just wash your hair as usual and then squeeze out the excess water. Work in your conditioner and then cover with a plastic cap and a towel on top of that (to hold in body heat). Leave the conditioner on for 15-30 minutes (less for finer hair) and then rinse out and style as usual. If you want to try a special deep conditioner, I use the Jessicurl Deep Conditioning Treatment. I have fine hair, and this DC doesn't weigh it down.

I'm not familiar with the Camille Rose ginger cleansing rinse. It looks to be a co-wash. Most low-porosity curlies do better with a sulfate-free shampoo. Co-washing tends to create build-up on low-porosity hair because such hair can't absorb the emollients very well. I would switch to a sulfate-free shampoo, and I would also do periodic washes with a sulfate to strip the hair of build-up. (Many of us on the forum use a sulfate periodically.)

I've never used the CR hair milk. If it is thick, it might not work very well on your low-porosity hair (or if your hair is fine, which it looks as if it may be from your photo). I would avoid the SM smoothie--most people have problems with it.

You might want to add a hard-hold gel to your regimen. Many of us find that we need a hard-hold gel to preserve our waves throughout the day.

Hope some of this helps.

Guide 65

Welcome!  We can't move threads, and I don't like to delete them once there's a reply.  It's fine to leave it here, or have 2 threads going at once.

@Therese1 gave you good advise.  I will add that Shea Moisture tends to work better for thicker hair - maybe coarser, or high porosity - not sure, but I know a lot of finer, thinner hair types have problems with it.  Try finding products without a lot of butters and oils.

Also, since you liked the Redken mousse, you might like AG Natural Cloud foam.  I've never tried the Redken one so I don't know how they compare, but I love the AG Cloud.  It's not a thick mousse, it's very light.  But it really gives me a lot more volume.  I always use a hard hold gel over it.

BrittanyM

The others gave you great advice.
It may be helpful for a styling products order varies but sort of remains the same.
LCG- leave in, cream, gel
LCEG- leave in, cream, enhancing gel, hold gel
LOC, LCO- leave in, cream or oil second and third
For most, start with LCG or just simply a leave in and gel to see how you do. Kinky Curly Knot Today is great and not heavy, so keep using that.
As far as styling, this is what I do since everyone does it differently. I add all products to soaking wet hair. Before I add gel, i brush my hair out with a tangle tweezer to distribute the products well. Then I add water to reform clumps, just a little bit over my head. Then I smooth my gel over and scrunch.
I hope this helps!

steadycetti

Oops! I am in the wrong spot. I'll ask this in the Low Porosity feed. How do I delete this post?

BrittanyM

Also you can either style upright or upside down. I personally do upright since my hair tangles easily and I don't like the look upside down gives me.

steadycetti

@Therese1 - Wow! Thank you so very much. Those are great tips.

I didn't realize the Camille Rose Ginger Rinse was a co-wash. I'm still having a hard time identifying what products are what! Perhaps I'll try the Shea Moisture Low Porosity Shampoo instead - have you had any experience with that? I'll search out a sulfate-free shampoo on this site.

I will try everything you mentioned - especially the deep conditioning and praying hands method!

One other question - how do you tell if a product is a "cream"? Also, I'm kind of terrified of a hard-hold gel (LA Looks? Is that what low po girls use?). I'm thinking of trying a flaxseed gel (either homemade or Aunt Jackie's) - thoughts?

@Guide 65 - Thank you, thank you! That product recommendation is great. Also, I'm glad to hear that most Low Po people can't do Shea Mouisture - it's praised everywhere and I was having a hard time!

@BrittanyM - Thank you!! That order of application is great. I will have to give those a go.

What do you like for a cream? What is considered a cream? Do you have a method for not looking slicked-down after applying hard-hold gel? I am applying my products to squished-out (more than damp) hair. 

Really appreciate you all! So very helpful.

BrittanyM

Products usually say cream or smoothie or something like that. They tend to be white and well, creamy. I haven't found a cream that I love quite yet, so still working on that. I do love Kinky Curly Knot Today as a leave in (I consider it my only Holy Grail as of right now). As far as gel, do not be afraid of hard hold gel. Once you apply all your products and styled how you want, do not touch your hair until is 100% dry. You will be left with crunchy curls. No problem, just gently scrunch out the crunch. This breaks the gel cast and should leave you with soft and moisturized curls.

steadycetti

@BrittanyM Ha! White and creamy.  Makes sense! Yes, I do like the Knot Today, too. I think I applied the appropriate amount today! First time. I'll search for a hard hold gel and give that a go. My only problem is patience! Takes my hair all day to air-dry. Trying to master a plop / diffuse situation. Thanks again for your insights!

[email protected]

I’m pretty new to this too. I also have a pretty similar hair type and live in Montana (dryest of dry)! 😝 I have also tried most of the products you are using with no luck. 

The CR hair milk gave me awful build up frizz. I’m guessing this is because of the cetyl esters, which I am now avoiding. I also had no luck with SM products, too heavy for my fine, LP hair! Try experimenting with some lighter sulfate-free shampoos and silicone-free conditioners. But be careful about silicone, it is sometimes in conditioners matched with sulfate-free shampoos.

The many thing that I have had success with is the hard gel! I’m kind of obsessed with it actually, I think it’s fasinating! Get some LA looks, don’t be afraid! Then scrunch it out when it’s dry, it won’t be hard. Trust me!

Now, about this dry climate, I’m still trying to figure that out. I’m trying to weed out the glycerin to see if my hair reacts better. This definitely takes time to figure out and there are several factors to consider, but don’t be discouraged! 

steadycetti

@[email protected] Love it! Glad we're in this together.  

Oh man. I'm glad you've had the same poor experience. I mean...not glad you've had a bad experience! But, good to not be alone.

I JUST bought LA Looks blue gel yesterday! I was excited to use it today...but my hair has fallen absolutely FLAT for two days now. I think I over-moisturized somehow. Or didn't use enough protein? 

You're experimenting with glycerin? I'd be curious to know what you find out!

steadycetti

Also, @[email protected] - Do you have a favorite sulfate-free shampoo? Or have you found a favorite conditioner?

Guide 65

steadycetti said:

...but my hair has fallen absolutely FLAT for two days now. I think I over-moisturized somehow. Or didn't use enough protein? 

Sounds like it's time to clarify!  Use a regular shampoo with sulfates but no silicones.  Most of us need to do that once in a while, to get a really good clean.  There are other ingredients besides silicones that build up in the hair and need to be cleaned off. 

Some people like to do a deep conditioning treatment after clarifying.  A cheap one you can find easily is the Garnier Nutris 1 Minute Hair Mask.  It's not the best, but it's CG friendly, plus cheap and easy to find. 

[email protected]

steadycetti said:

Also, @[email protected] - Do you have a favorite sulfate-free shampoo? Or have you found a favorite conditioner?

I’ve been using Mop Top and I do like it (much better than SM!), but it does have glycerine! I might try Innersense after I get $, but I’m not giving up on the Mop Top just yet and I can’t afford to keep buying new shampoo.

So far I like Curls LI, a little goes a long way and it does have some protein. My hair seems to like a little protein, even though it’s somewhat LP. After the LI I put in Jojoba oil to “seal” and that seemed to make a big difference!

I agree with Guide 65 that you probably need to clarify. I would clarify, deep condition, then slowly add different products and techniques. I would try the sealing method, as I think that has made the biggest difference for me so far! 

steadycetti

@Guide 65 I'm slightly nervous about clarifying...again. I've done it twice since the beginning of September. I'm afraid that doing it again will be too much? Perhaps I've been experimenting with so many products that I do need to!

Today I skipped doing a leave-in altogether (I've been doing a pea-sized amount of Kinky Kurly Knot Today) and used Mop Top Gentle Shampoo and Daily Conditioner instead of SM Lo Po. Then I styled with LA Looks gel only. It seems to be behaving. Think that's a moisture/protein issue? 

This is almost dry, right before scrunching out the crunch.


This is right after scrunching out the crunch.

steadycetti

@[email protected] Jojoba oil! I haven't tried that yet! I'll have to give it a go. I'm glad you like it! Do you then put a gel on afterward?

I think I like Mop Top's shampoo & conditioner, but not leave-in or custard. The jury's still out. 

I have yet to deep condition! Perhaps it's time to give it a whirl and make sure my hair is clarified too. Thank you for your advice!!

[email protected]

steadycetti said:

@[email protected] Jojoba oil! I haven't tried that yet! I'll have to give it a go. I'm glad you like it! Do you then put a gel on afterward?

I think I like Mop Top's shampoo & conditioner, but not leave-in or custard. The jury's still out. 

I have yet to deep condition! Perhaps it's time to give it a whirl and make sure my hair is clarified too. Thank you for your advice!!

Yes, I put the oil on after my leave in and then put gel over it that. I haven’t tried the Moo Top leave in or custard.

Good luck! I hope you are enjoying the cold weather 😬.

steadycetti

Mid-day update: Waves are still there (not flat, yay!) but everything looks and feels very dry. 

steadycetti

@[email protected] The change in weather is pretty nice!! Have a lovely weekend.

Therese1

Hello again. I've been away from the forum for a few days so am just now getting back to you. 

You had asked whether I have experience with the SM low-po product. I have used the shampoo but not the conditioner. To be honest, it's not that amazing. It's like any other low poo (=sulfate-free poo). I haven't seen any low-po curlies raving about the low-po SM product.

As for flaxseed gel, IMO, it is better for frizz control and curl definition than for hold. It actually has very little hold. It makes my hair overly soft. You could make some and try it out just to see its effect on your hair. It costs hardly anything to make.

It looks like you are getting the hang of the hard-hold gel! I think hard-hold gel is a really important product for wavies who need more curl definition. 

Since your hair is low po, I would definitely look into diffusing (I think you air-dry?). Diffusing with warm heat helps open up the hair cuticle so that it absorbs product better.

It's not uncommon for hair to fall flat midday from dryness if you are experiencing weather with very low dew points. When our weather gets like that, that is when I start deep conditioning. Since my hair is fine, I do it only once every 1-2 weeks. Maybe try it and see how your hair reacts.