Thoughts on oil treatment in a no shampoo regime

SiraSira Posts: 14Registered Users, Curl Ambassador Curl Novice
I watched Lorraine's M. in a Q&A video and she mentioned that she isn't sure about oils anymore..
So I've got some doubts relating to this, and I would like to know your opinion as well,

Maybe i am completely wrong, so please correct me if im missing something:

From what I know, the CG Method recommends to use water based products.

Okay, so what about oils? If I smear my hair with oils, then they will go into the cuticle, and so by using water based products:

-Am I really removing those oils?
 and
-Am I not creating extra build up...?

Okay, so a second thought on this would be:

If the natural products with no sulfates no silicones, no parabens and so on, are water based but they contain butters and oils as well, it means they've got to have an emulsifyer or similar....
so once you wash your hair again with conditioner they are supposed to dissolve oil as well doesn't it?

From your experience what are your thoughts on this?



Comments

  • Therese1Therese1 Posts: 2,563Registered Users Curl Virtuoso
    My understanding is that co-washing is able to dissolve some amount of oil for the reason you mention: conditioners generally contain oils as well as water, and emulsifiers. Like dissolves like.

    Now, if you have a LOT of oil in your hair (say you put a lot of oil on as a pre-poo), a conditioner might not be able to get all of that out, in which case you would want to turn to something stronger, a shampoo.

    Putting oils on the hair does not necessarily mean build-up. As you point out, many types of oils absorb into the hair and do not coat the hair. Butters are oils that coat the hair and are (I'm guessing) more likely to build up.

    I haven't read the Q&A, so I'm sorry if I'm not addressing the actual question.
    Low poo: Intelligent Nutrients (IN) Harmonic; Oribe Cleansing Creme
    RO: IN Harmonic
    LI: CJ Beauticurls; Jessicurl (JC) Gelebration Spray
    DC: JC Deep Conditioning Treatment; Weleda Rosemary Conditioning Oil
    Stylers: JC Confident Coils; IN Volumizing Spray; IN Perfect Hold Hairspray; John Masters Sea Mist; Bumble Bb. Gel; Kenra Firm-Hold Gel; Sevi Blue Yarrow Sea Salt Spray
    Low-porosity 2a/b baby-fine hair
  • bomegabomega Posts: 1,355Registered Users Curl Virtuoso
    And to add to what @Therese1 said, butters, while have the potential for buildup also support hydration and help with styling, so they aren't necessarily bad either.

    I didn't see the Q&A either, but I'm not sure why Lorraine wouldn't be sure about oil anymore. Oils have their place in the care and maintanence of hair. Here are a couple of articles on the Sciency Hair Blog that might interest you:
    http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.com/2014/03/oil-pre-shampoo-or-pre-wash.html
    http://science-yhairblog.blogspot.com/2014/03/managing-elasticity-and-porosity-in-hair.html

    Mostly though, find out what your hair likes by experimenting. One of my favorite treatments of all time is oil treatment after my henna/indigo treatment. After shampoo/rinseout conditioner to remove the indigo, I apply oil (I am currently using a coconut/seseme oil blend) to my hair, completely saturating it. I apply when wet (not what the Sciency Hair Blog recommends). Then shampoo/condition the next morning. This gives me the best hair, and even the next day, it looks good. 
    Low-poo: Alaffia Coffee & Shea Revitalizing Shampoo for Fine/Thin Hair (summer), Alaffia Coconut & Shea Hydrating Shampoo
    Clarify: Kinky Curly Come Clean
    Rinse-out: Alaffia Coffee & Shea Revitalizing Conditioner for Fine/Thin Hair (summer), Alaffia Everyday Coconut Ultra Hydrating Conditioner
    DT: Camille Rose Naturals Algae Renew Deep Conditioner
    Leave-in: As I Am Leave-in
    Styler: Lily of the Desert 99% Aloe Vera Gelly
    Treatment: Daily tea spray; Coconut oil overnight treatment; Citric acid rinse for hard water; 2-step Henndigo w/ amla to cover gray

    2C, fine, low porosity, low/medium density, protein sensitive

    Looking for styling products and tools

    iHerb Code KQS149 for 5% off your order
  • jeepcurlygurljeepcurlygurl Posts: 20,727Registered Users, Curl Ambassador Curl Virtuoso
    Ditto what others said - it all boils down to which oils you use, which oils your hair likes, experimenting to find what works.
    I do pre-poos and deep treatments with lots of coconut oil and other oil mixtures and only wash with conditioners and I don't have any issues with build up.
    --I'm located in Western PA.   --I found NC in late 2004, CG since February 2005, joined the forums in May 2005, started going grey in late 2005.   --My hair is 3B with some 3A, currently at mid back length when dry,  texture-medium/fine, porosity-top is low, middle is medium, ends are porous, elasticity-normal.   --My long time favorite products are Suave & VO5 conditioners, LA Looks Sport Gel, coconut oil, honey, vinegar.   
    --My CG and grey hair progress -  
    http://www.naturallycurly.com/curltalk/going-gray/179328-jeepys-grey-hair-progress.html   
    --My article at NaturallyCurly about going grey - 
    https://www.naturallycurly.com/curlreading/color/how-i-went-completely-gray-and-loved-it
  • SiraSira Posts: 14Registered Users, Curl Ambassador Curl Novice
    edited February 2018
    Thank you both @Therese1 and @bomega ;for your answers,
    the articles are very interesting as well.

    I guess since our body produces oils, external oils can also help to naturally add propierties to our hair and skin, body in general. We also eat oils and they are good for us in many ways so they shouldn't be that evil.
     
    @bomega ;It makes sense to me to apply it when wet as well, so water which has penetrated the hair repels it and the cuticle doesn't get overloaded with oil.

    In fact, since I don't have a deep conditioning treatment yet, today I decided to give a go at a non dying henna and almond oil I had laying around for ages. I did wash it out with DC no poo and one condition, my hair ain't completely dry yet it is about 85% dry (its taking like 5 hours to dry today, ((where is the gun emoji for this cases?))) but it already feels softer and smoother, Im getting less volume and it feels a just slightly greasy though.

    I'll just keep experimenting, but I think I will just deep condition once a week plus oil treatment once or twice a month the most, lets see what my hair wants...

    Ohh if the hair could just talk and say ''if you put this on me ill behave''

    Here is the link to Lorraine's Q&A in case you want to watch it, it is from December 2017, the point where she talks about oils is about minute 18:00 : 
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khhjlz63qq4&t=1906s




  • SiraSira Posts: 14Registered Users, Curl Ambassador Curl Novice
    Ditto what others said - it all boils down to which oils you use, which oils your hair likes, experimenting to find what works.
    I do pre-poos and deep treatments with lots of coconut oil and other oil mixtures and only wash with conditioners and I don't have any issues with build up.
    Thanks @jeepcurlygurl

    Do you leave your conditioner for few minutes or so to get rid of excess oil?
    Does one wash do the job? or do you need to apply conditioner twice?
  • jeepcurlygurljeepcurlygurl Posts: 20,727Registered Users, Curl Ambassador Curl Virtuoso
    ^ I don't leave my conditioner on any longer than usual. Just long enough to give my scalp a good massage and detangle. I do not apply conditioner twice.
    --I'm located in Western PA.   --I found NC in late 2004, CG since February 2005, joined the forums in May 2005, started going grey in late 2005.   --My hair is 3B with some 3A, currently at mid back length when dry,  texture-medium/fine, porosity-top is low, middle is medium, ends are porous, elasticity-normal.   --My long time favorite products are Suave & VO5 conditioners, LA Looks Sport Gel, coconut oil, honey, vinegar.   
    --My CG and grey hair progress -  
    http://www.naturallycurly.com/curltalk/going-gray/179328-jeepys-grey-hair-progress.html   
    --My article at NaturallyCurly about going grey - 
    https://www.naturallycurly.com/curlreading/color/how-i-went-completely-gray-and-loved-it
  • bomegabomega Posts: 1,355Registered Users Curl Virtuoso
    Sira said:
    Thank you both @Therese1 and @bomega ;for your answers,
    the articles are very interesting as well.

    I guess since our body produces oils, external oils can also help to naturally add propierties to our hair and skin, body in general. We also eat oils and they are good for us in many ways so they shouldn't be that evil.
     
    @bomega ;It makes sense to me to apply it when wet as well, so water which has penetrated the hair repels it and the cuticle doesn't get overloaded with oil.

    In fact, since I don't have a deep conditioning treatment yet, today I decided to give a go at a non dying henna and almond oil I had laying around for ages. I did wash it out with DC no poo and one condition, my hair ain't completely dry yet it is about 85% dry (its taking like 5 hours to dry today, ((where is the gun emoji for this cases?))) but it already feels softer and smoother, Im getting less volume and it feels a just slightly greasy though.

    I'll just keep experimenting, but I think I will just deep condition once a week plus oil treatment once or twice a month the most, lets see what my hair wants...

    Ohh if the hair could just talk and say ''if you put this on me ill behave''

    Here is the link to Lorraine's Q&A in case you want to watch it, it is from December 2017, the point where she talks about oils is about minute 18:00 : 
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khhjlz63qq4&t=1906s




    Sometimes an oil treatment feels greasy to me to. I guess I wash everyday, so if the excess oil doesn't come out in one wash, it will in the next, so I don't worry about it. But I think others adjust the amount of oil they use. I guess another thing to experiment with. :)

    I know what you mean - I wish hair would just say what they mean! ;) 

    Thanks for the link of Lorraine's Q&A. I'll check it out. :)
    Low-poo: Alaffia Coffee & Shea Revitalizing Shampoo for Fine/Thin Hair (summer), Alaffia Coconut & Shea Hydrating Shampoo
    Clarify: Kinky Curly Come Clean
    Rinse-out: Alaffia Coffee & Shea Revitalizing Conditioner for Fine/Thin Hair (summer), Alaffia Everyday Coconut Ultra Hydrating Conditioner
    DT: Camille Rose Naturals Algae Renew Deep Conditioner
    Leave-in: As I Am Leave-in
    Styler: Lily of the Desert 99% Aloe Vera Gelly
    Treatment: Daily tea spray; Coconut oil overnight treatment; Citric acid rinse for hard water; 2-step Henndigo w/ amla to cover gray

    2C, fine, low porosity, low/medium density, protein sensitive

    Looking for styling products and tools

    iHerb Code KQS149 for 5% off your order
  • bomegabomega Posts: 1,355Registered Users Curl Virtuoso
    edited February 2018
    I also meant to say I think that I like the oil pre-treatment when wet because I think it helps seal in some moisture when I do it that way. However I the Sciency Hair Blog suggests it dry to minimize water-logging and reduce the risk of hygral fatigue. I think that would be helpful for coarse haired people. I've done it dry also, and I get some benefit too for having the oil in the hair shaft, but it seems better when I do the pre-treatment on wet hair.
    Low-poo: Alaffia Coffee & Shea Revitalizing Shampoo for Fine/Thin Hair (summer), Alaffia Coconut & Shea Hydrating Shampoo
    Clarify: Kinky Curly Come Clean
    Rinse-out: Alaffia Coffee & Shea Revitalizing Conditioner for Fine/Thin Hair (summer), Alaffia Everyday Coconut Ultra Hydrating Conditioner
    DT: Camille Rose Naturals Algae Renew Deep Conditioner
    Leave-in: As I Am Leave-in
    Styler: Lily of the Desert 99% Aloe Vera Gelly
    Treatment: Daily tea spray; Coconut oil overnight treatment; Citric acid rinse for hard water; 2-step Henndigo w/ amla to cover gray

    2C, fine, low porosity, low/medium density, protein sensitive

    Looking for styling products and tools

    iHerb Code KQS149 for 5% off your order
  • SiraSira Posts: 14Registered Users, Curl Ambassador Curl Novice
    edited February 2018
    I had pretty good results using coconut oil when i was co washing a year and a half ago, i was using it as a pre-cowash on wet/on dry as a styler....to cook food :p , my hair was frizz free, nice curls and ringlets, also a lot of people were complementing my hair, downside was a lack of volume some days and the sensation that my hair was darker than my original color..... :#

    Even though using oil on a daily basis went terribly well, I want to be cautious this time cause as I said in my introduction post, the last time I was co washing I had the feel I was shedding some hair(could be also stress-related, or not clarifying AT ALL, or just that I was waiting long in between washes so all the hair would appear to be falling out on the wash day) So yasss, less oils more clarifying, better products, let my hair 'breath' by not putting styling products on for at least 1 day a week and see how it goes this nu cowash formula. 

    I like the sciency hair blog, there are nice good reads there  @bomega ;  :)


     

  • GretchenGretchen Administrator Posts: 10,840Moderators Curl Virtuoso
    Hi @Sira!  Welcome to CurlTalk! 

    Gretchen
    NaturallyCurly.com co-founder
    3A

    You are beautiful!

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