Extracts in products?

ttoosdayttoosday Registered Users Posts: 509 Curl Connoisseur
Does anybody know- do extracts in hair products really do anything? Other than flower up the ingredient list?
What category do extracts fall into - Humectant? Emollient? Occlusive? Maybe they don't really fit into any category because they don't really do anything? Thoughts?
CG since 11/2014
Mostly 2B, but ranges A-C front to back and root to tip
Low density, very coarse, high porosity
Collarbone length, gray dyed brown, dry and rough
Typical LEG routine could be any combination of:
Lo poo: Shea Moisture brand shampoo, Ion Hard Water Shampoo
Cowash: As I Am Coc Cowash
RO: GVP CB, Aussie Mega Moist, Not Your Mothers Gardenia
Leave In: As I Am LI, KCKT, or Not Your Mothers Gardenia
Enhancer: Camille Rose Curl Maker
Deep condition: SM Deep Treat Mask
Protein: Hask Keratin
Styler: Curl Keeper Original, Ouidad Climate Control gel, LA Looks gel

Comments

  • WavycatWavycat Registered Users Posts: 326 Curl Connoisseur
    I guess it depends. Are you talking about extracts like essential oils? Or some other extracts?
    SE PA
    2C/3A med, med density,med elasticity, high porosity color-treated
    No Poo: various VO5s testing Gliss Volumizing (keratin) for summer
    Citric acid rinse or vinegar
    RO: SM Honey Mask with agave
    Conditioner only styling with water, water and more water, or jojoba + SM Superfruit
    Styler: KCCC or Ecostyler Olive Oil occasionally
    Love most oils but can't use CO in winter
  • ttoosdayttoosday Registered Users Posts: 509 Curl Connoisseur
    I guess mainly herbal extracts. Things like chamomile, rosemary, marshmallow root etc, things like that. But Im also interested in whether essential oils work too.
    CG since 11/2014
    Mostly 2B, but ranges A-C front to back and root to tip
    Low density, very coarse, high porosity
    Collarbone length, gray dyed brown, dry and rough
    Typical LEG routine could be any combination of:
    Lo poo: Shea Moisture brand shampoo, Ion Hard Water Shampoo
    Cowash: As I Am Coc Cowash
    RO: GVP CB, Aussie Mega Moist, Not Your Mothers Gardenia
    Leave In: As I Am LI, KCKT, or Not Your Mothers Gardenia
    Enhancer: Camille Rose Curl Maker
    Deep condition: SM Deep Treat Mask
    Protein: Hask Keratin
    Styler: Curl Keeper Original, Ouidad Climate Control gel, LA Looks gel
  • WavycatWavycat Registered Users Posts: 326 Curl Connoisseur
    My feeling is they do. I know if I add to my mister some things make my hair dryer (surprisingly lavender does) and other things can make my hair oiler. I know the marshmallow root and what not are supposed to add slip and if I brew some it is very slippery. Maybe Naturecat will be along soon.
    SE PA
    2C/3A med, med density,med elasticity, high porosity color-treated
    No Poo: various VO5s testing Gliss Volumizing (keratin) for summer
    Citric acid rinse or vinegar
    RO: SM Honey Mask with agave
    Conditioner only styling with water, water and more water, or jojoba + SM Superfruit
    Styler: KCCC or Ecostyler Olive Oil occasionally
    Love most oils but can't use CO in winter
  • Therese1Therese1 Registered Users Posts: 2,563 Curl Virtuoso
    I have used marshmallow tea for my hair, and yes, it definitely does something. It acts similar to aloe, but it doesn't make my hair as soft. There are several herbs in this category. Naturecat's Irish moss (carageenan) is in this category (film-forming humectants is what I think they're called).

    A few years ago, I made some chamomile tea and used that to refresh my hair instead of plain water (I used a spritzer bottle with just the tea). It didn't give me as much frizz as plain water alone. If I weren't so lazy I would try it again.

    Short answer: The extracts most definitely do something.

    The problem I have with a lot of extracts is that you don't know what they are. They could be oils or proteins or humectants; the labeling doesn't tell you. I just tried the DevaCurl Wavemaker, which lists a lot of herbal extracts. I was concerned about some of the seed extracts, because seeds have protein, and my hair is sensitive to protein. Sure enough, my hair did not like the Deva. But when something is called "extract," I have no idea whether it has protein for sure or not. You could be extracting any part of the herb.
    Low poo: Intelligent Nutrients (IN) Harmonic; Oribe Cleansing Creme
    RO: IN Harmonic
    LI: CJ Beauticurls; Jessicurl (JC) Gelebration Spray
    DC: JC Deep Conditioning Treatment; Weleda Rosemary Conditioning Oil
    Stylers: JC Confident Coils; IN Volumizing Spray; IN Perfect Hold Hairspray; John Masters Sea Mist; Bumble Bb. Gel; Kenra Firm-Hold Gel; Sevi Blue Yarrow Sea Salt Spray
    Low-porosity 2a/b baby-fine hair
  • Therese1Therese1 Registered Users Posts: 2,563 Curl Virtuoso
    dupe
    Low poo: Intelligent Nutrients (IN) Harmonic; Oribe Cleansing Creme
    RO: IN Harmonic
    LI: CJ Beauticurls; Jessicurl (JC) Gelebration Spray
    DC: JC Deep Conditioning Treatment; Weleda Rosemary Conditioning Oil
    Stylers: JC Confident Coils; IN Volumizing Spray; IN Perfect Hold Hairspray; John Masters Sea Mist; Bumble Bb. Gel; Kenra Firm-Hold Gel; Sevi Blue Yarrow Sea Salt Spray
    Low-porosity 2a/b baby-fine hair
  • ttoosdayttoosday Registered Users Posts: 509 Curl Connoisseur
    Therese1 wrote: »

    The problem I have with a lot of extracts is that you don't know what they are. They could be oils or proteins or humectants; the labeling doesn't tell you. I just tried the DevaCurl Wavemaker, which lists a lot of herbal extracts. I was concerned about some of the seed extracts, because seeds have protein, and my hair is sensitive to protein. Sure enough, my hair did not like the Deva. But when something is called "extract," I have no idea whether it has protein for sure or not. You could be extracting any part of the herb.
    Hmm yes commercial product extracts fall into the category of "very vague." Also to be considered is what percentage is in the formula- also something a person could really never know in a commercial product. If/when you make your own products, are they made with tiny tiny amounts of extract like .001% or less (what I perceive is "practically nothing" and what I figure would typically be in a commercial product, but I really have no idea)? I guess what I'm asking is do you likely use more than a manufacturer would, and would that make a difference in how well it would provide a result in your hair?
    CG since 11/2014
    Mostly 2B, but ranges A-C front to back and root to tip
    Low density, very coarse, high porosity
    Collarbone length, gray dyed brown, dry and rough
    Typical LEG routine could be any combination of:
    Lo poo: Shea Moisture brand shampoo, Ion Hard Water Shampoo
    Cowash: As I Am Coc Cowash
    RO: GVP CB, Aussie Mega Moist, Not Your Mothers Gardenia
    Leave In: As I Am LI, KCKT, or Not Your Mothers Gardenia
    Enhancer: Camille Rose Curl Maker
    Deep condition: SM Deep Treat Mask
    Protein: Hask Keratin
    Styler: Curl Keeper Original, Ouidad Climate Control gel, LA Looks gel
  • machermacher Registered Users Posts: 1,031 Curl Connoisseur
    ttoosday wrote: »
    I guess mainly herbal extracts. Things like chamomile, rosemary, marshmallow root etc, things like that. But Im also interested in whether essential oils work too.

    In the last month I've stayed away from products with extracts except Deva Frizz Free Volumizing which I don't use a lot of an dilute in my palms. Currently my routine is working decent and don't want to mess with added extracts. Seems like when I was using products with extracts wasn't getting good results.
  • bomegabomega Registered Users Posts: 1,355 Curl Virtuoso
    ttoosday wrote: »
    Therese1 wrote: »

    The problem I have with a lot of extracts is that you don't know what they are. They could be oils or proteins or humectants; the labeling doesn't tell you. I just tried the DevaCurl Wavemaker, which lists a lot of herbal extracts. I was concerned about some of the seed extracts, because seeds have protein, and my hair is sensitive to protein. Sure enough, my hair did not like the Deva. But when something is called "extract," I have no idea whether it has protein for sure or not. You could be extracting any part of the herb.
    Hmm yes commercial product extracts fall into the category of "very vague." Also to be considered is what percentage is in the formula- also something a person could really never know in a commercial product. If/when you make your own products, are they made with tiny tiny amounts of extract like .001% or less (what I perceive is "practically nothing" and what I figure would typically be in a commercial product, but I really have no idea)? I guess what I'm asking is do you likely use more than a manufacturer would, and would that make a difference in how well it would provide a result in your hair?
    You can estimate how much is in commercial products by its position in the list of ingredients. It is likely that a home made product has more of an extract than a commercial product, but more likely for many reasons:
    - A home made product doesn't have things the commercial product has in it
    - A home made product is made with different processes than the commercial product
    - A commercial product is designed to be manufactured for a certain result but also to optimize cost. Sometimes a commercial product puts a minute amount of something just so they can say its there. But sometimes a commercial product is aiming to use that item for a certain result.

    A lot of skeptics of natural-type solutions cite the claims you make in your original message for their skepticism, but what they don't realize is that many "commercial" solutions have their origins in the same traditional solutions, natural remedies and herbal extracts that they disparage.

    ETA: To answer your original questions: Yes, it has been my experience that extracts in hair products do do something, but what they do depends on the extract, and some might do more than one thing. :)
    Low-poo: Alaffia Coffee & Shea Revitalizing Shampoo for Fine/Thin Hair (summer), Alaffia Coconut & Shea Hydrating Shampoo
    Clarify: Kinky Curly Come Clean
    Rinse-out: Alaffia Coffee & Shea Revitalizing Conditioner for Fine/Thin Hair (summer), Alaffia Everyday Coconut Ultra Hydrating Conditioner
    DT: Camille Rose Naturals Algae Renew Deep Conditioner
    Leave-in: As I Am Leave-in
    Styler: Lily of the Desert 99% Aloe Vera Gelly
    Treatment: Daily tea spray; Coconut oil overnight treatment; Citric acid rinse for hard water; 2-step Henndigo w/ amla to cover gray

    2C, fine, low porosity, low/medium density, protein sensitive

    Looking for styling products and tools

    iHerb Code KQS149 for 5% off your order
  • bomegabomega Registered Users Posts: 1,355 Curl Virtuoso
    Hey Macher, I've been following your journey, and your results with the Sally's GVP are really great. I would point out though that GVP Balm has herbal extracts in it. They are low on the list - past the parabens, but they are there. But, honestly, if it wasn't for the parabens, I would try this product and really try to make it work, based on your results (and those extracts help my decision too.)
    Low-poo: Alaffia Coffee & Shea Revitalizing Shampoo for Fine/Thin Hair (summer), Alaffia Coconut & Shea Hydrating Shampoo
    Clarify: Kinky Curly Come Clean
    Rinse-out: Alaffia Coffee & Shea Revitalizing Conditioner for Fine/Thin Hair (summer), Alaffia Everyday Coconut Ultra Hydrating Conditioner
    DT: Camille Rose Naturals Algae Renew Deep Conditioner
    Leave-in: As I Am Leave-in
    Styler: Lily of the Desert 99% Aloe Vera Gelly
    Treatment: Daily tea spray; Coconut oil overnight treatment; Citric acid rinse for hard water; 2-step Henndigo w/ amla to cover gray

    2C, fine, low porosity, low/medium density, protein sensitive

    Looking for styling products and tools

    iHerb Code KQS149 for 5% off your order
  • machermacher Registered Users Posts: 1,031 Curl Connoisseur
    bomega wrote: »
    Hey Macher, I've been following your journey, and your results with the Sally's GVP are really great. I would point out though that GVP Balm has herbal extracts in it. They are low on the list - past the parabens, but they are there. But, honestly, if it wasn't for the parabens, I would try this product and really try to make it work, based on your results (and those extracts help my decision too.)

    What I like about GVP Conditioning Balm is the ingredients list is short. There are extracts but doesn't seem too much compared to a lot of conditioners on the market. Never thought about the parabens but I'm ok with it.
  • ttoosdayttoosday Registered Users Posts: 509 Curl Connoisseur
    macher wrote: »
    ttoosday wrote: »
    I guess mainly herbal extracts. Things like chamomile, rosemary, marshmallow root etc, things like that. But Im also interested in whether essential oils work too.

    In the last month I've stayed away from products with extracts except Deva Frizz Free Volumizing which I don't use a lot of an dilute in my palms. Currently my routine is working decent and don't want to mess with added extracts. Seems like when I was using products with extracts wasn't getting good results.

    Macher, how are you liking the frizz free volumizing foam? I have just started using this, and so far I really like it. Yesterday I got too much of something, either the foam, or my leave in, or gel, because i had some serious producty feeling all around the scalp and it was 1st day hair. Today i low poo-d and then tried again using a little bit less of all three and its much better. Im really liking the definition.
    CG since 11/2014
    Mostly 2B, but ranges A-C front to back and root to tip
    Low density, very coarse, high porosity
    Collarbone length, gray dyed brown, dry and rough
    Typical LEG routine could be any combination of:
    Lo poo: Shea Moisture brand shampoo, Ion Hard Water Shampoo
    Cowash: As I Am Coc Cowash
    RO: GVP CB, Aussie Mega Moist, Not Your Mothers Gardenia
    Leave In: As I Am LI, KCKT, or Not Your Mothers Gardenia
    Enhancer: Camille Rose Curl Maker
    Deep condition: SM Deep Treat Mask
    Protein: Hask Keratin
    Styler: Curl Keeper Original, Ouidad Climate Control gel, LA Looks gel
  • machermacher Registered Users Posts: 1,031 Curl Connoisseur
    ttoosday wrote: »
    macher wrote: »
    ttoosday wrote: »
    I guess mainly herbal extracts. Things like chamomile, rosemary, marshmallow root etc, things like that. But Im also interested in whether essential oils work too.

    In the last month I've stayed away from products with extracts except Deva Frizz Free Volumizing which I don't use a lot of an dilute in my palms. Currently my routine is working decent and don't want to mess with added extracts. Seems like when I was using products with extracts wasn't getting good results.

    Macher, how are you liking the frizz free volumizing foam? I have just started using this, and so far I really like it. Yesterday I got too much of something, either the foam, or my leave in, or gel, because i had some serious producty feeling all around the scalp and it was 1st day hair. Today i low poo-d and then tried again using a little bit less of all three and its much better. Im really liking the definition.

    Deva Frizz Free Volumizing Foam is almost a holy grail for me. But I can't use too much. I think the polyquat if I use too much or don't dilute it makes my hair 'wet but not wet'. But it gives me incredible definition. I havent used it this week cause I'm testing my hair without a styler.

    Like I said I have to dilute it in my palms and I use VERY little when I do dilute it. I can't use it everyday cause like I said it either is Build Up or the wet but not wet look. Seems to stay in my hair for a couple of days and gets re-activated with a my spritz mixture. Makes my waves shiny and defined if I use the right amount.

    Also what I found is it works better on my hair when it's almost dry.
  • ttoosdayttoosday Registered Users Posts: 509 Curl Connoisseur
    macher wrote: »
    ttoosday wrote: »
    macher wrote: »

    In the last month I've stayed away from products with extracts except Deva Frizz Free Volumizing which I don't use a lot of an dilute in my palms. Currently my routine is working decent and don't want to mess with added extracts. Seems like when I was using products with extracts wasn't getting good results.

    Macher, how are you liking the frizz free volumizing foam? I have just started using this, and so far I really like it. Yesterday I got too much of something, either the foam, or my leave in, or gel, because i had some serious producty feeling all around the scalp and it was 1st day hair. Today i low poo-d and then tried again using a little bit less of all three and its much better. Im really liking the definition.

    Deva Frizz Free Volumizing Foam is almost a holy grail for me. But I can't use too much. I think the polyquat if I use too much or don't dilute it makes my hair 'wet but not wet'. But it gives me incredible definition. I havent used it this week cause I'm testing my hair without a styler.

    Like I said I have to dilute it in my palms and I use VERY little when I do dilute it. I can't use it everyday cause like I said it either is Build Up or the wet but not wet look. Seems to stay in my hair for a couple of days and gets re-activated with a my spritz mixture. Makes my waves shiny and defined if I use the right amount.

    Also what I found is it works better on my hair when it's almost dry.

    I'm curious how it does for 2nd day for me. Well, with newer formula, the polyquat 69 is gone and polyquat 68 is added but is way way way down near the end of the ingred list. Perhaps you will like that even more.
    CG since 11/2014
    Mostly 2B, but ranges A-C front to back and root to tip
    Low density, very coarse, high porosity
    Collarbone length, gray dyed brown, dry and rough
    Typical LEG routine could be any combination of:
    Lo poo: Shea Moisture brand shampoo, Ion Hard Water Shampoo
    Cowash: As I Am Coc Cowash
    RO: GVP CB, Aussie Mega Moist, Not Your Mothers Gardenia
    Leave In: As I Am LI, KCKT, or Not Your Mothers Gardenia
    Enhancer: Camille Rose Curl Maker
    Deep condition: SM Deep Treat Mask
    Protein: Hask Keratin
    Styler: Curl Keeper Original, Ouidad Climate Control gel, LA Looks gel
  • machermacher Registered Users Posts: 1,031 Curl Connoisseur
    ttoosday wrote: »
    macher wrote: »
    ttoosday wrote: »

    Macher, how are you liking the frizz free volumizing foam? I have just started using this, and so far I really like it. Yesterday I got too much of something, either the foam, or my leave in, or gel, because i had some serious producty feeling all around the scalp and it was 1st day hair. Today i low poo-d and then tried again using a little bit less of all three and its much better. Im really liking the definition.

    Deva Frizz Free Volumizing Foam is almost a holy grail for me. But I can't use too much. I think the polyquat if I use too much or don't dilute it makes my hair 'wet but not wet'. But it gives me incredible definition. I havent used it this week cause I'm testing my hair without a styler.

    Like I said I have to dilute it in my palms and I use VERY little when I do dilute it. I can't use it everyday cause like I said it either is Build Up or the wet but not wet look. Seems to stay in my hair for a couple of days and gets re-activated with a my spritz mixture. Makes my waves shiny and defined if I use the right amount.

    Also what I found is it works better on my hair when it's almost dry.

    I'm curious how it does for 2nd day for me. Well, with newer formula, the polyquat 69 is gone and polyquat 68 is added but is way way way down near the end of the ingred list. Perhaps you will like that even more.

    According to the Deva website the ingredients are the same ...

    INGREDIENTS:
    Water (Aqua, Eau), Polyquaternium-69, Polysorbate 20, Melissa Officinalis Extract, Humulus Lupulus (Hops) Extract, Cymbopogon Schoenanthus Extract, Chamomilla Recutita (Matricaria) Extract, Rosmarinus Officinalis (Rosemary) Extract, Achillea Millefolium Extract, Cetrimonium Chloride, Fragrance (Parfum), Polyimide-1, Propylene Glycol, PEG-10 Sunflower Glycerides, Disodium EDTA, Glycerin, Aminomethyl Propanol, Diazolidinyl Urea, Imidazolidinyl Urea, Iodopropynyl Butylcarbamate, Citric Acid.
  • ttoosdayttoosday Registered Users Posts: 509 Curl Connoisseur
    [/QUOTE]

    According to the Deva website the ingredients are the same ...

    INGREDIENTS:
    Water (Aqua, Eau), Polyquaternium-69, Polysorbate 20, Melissa Officinalis Extract, Humulus Lupulus (Hops) Extract, Cymbopogon Schoenanthus Extract, Chamomilla Recutita (Matricaria) Extract, Rosmarinus Officinalis (Rosemary) Extract, Achillea Millefolium Extract, Cetrimonium Chloride, Fragrance (Parfum), Polyimide-1, Propylene Glycol, PEG-10 Sunflower Glycerides, Disodium EDTA, Glycerin, Aminomethyl Propanol, Diazolidinyl Urea, Imidazolidinyl Urea, Iodopropynyl Butylcarbamate, Citric Acid.[/QUOTE]

    I learned today while posting in another thread that the foam has a new formula on some bottles. If it's the newer label and it does not have the little circle on the label that says "new look same formula," it likely is the new formula.
    CG since 11/2014
    Mostly 2B, but ranges A-C front to back and root to tip
    Low density, very coarse, high porosity
    Collarbone length, gray dyed brown, dry and rough
    Typical LEG routine could be any combination of:
    Lo poo: Shea Moisture brand shampoo, Ion Hard Water Shampoo
    Cowash: As I Am Coc Cowash
    RO: GVP CB, Aussie Mega Moist, Not Your Mothers Gardenia
    Leave In: As I Am LI, KCKT, or Not Your Mothers Gardenia
    Enhancer: Camille Rose Curl Maker
    Deep condition: SM Deep Treat Mask
    Protein: Hask Keratin
    Styler: Curl Keeper Original, Ouidad Climate Control gel, LA Looks gel

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