Pre-poo with sealing oils?

Therese1Therese1 Registered Users Posts: 2,563 Curl Virtuoso
I have seen some people on the forum say that they do a pre-poo with oils that are generally used as sealers (like grapeseed). My understanding is that most sealing oils do not penetrate the hair and that a pre-poo is generally done with a hair-penetrating oil. Is the nonpenetrating oil pre-poo used instead to seal the hair and prevent it from picking up so much water and swelling and having the cuticle chip off?
Low poo: Intelligent Nutrients (IN) Harmonic; Oribe Cleansing Creme
RO: IN Harmonic
LI: CJ Beauticurls; Jessicurl (JC) Gelebration Spray
DC: JC Deep Conditioning Treatment; Weleda Rosemary Conditioning Oil
Stylers: JC Confident Coils; IN Volumizing Spray; IN Perfect Hold Hairspray; John Masters Sea Mist; Bumble Bb. Gel; Kenra Firm-Hold Gel; Sevi Blue Yarrow Sea Salt Spray
Low-porosity 2a/b baby-fine hair

Comments

  • rbbrbb Registered Users Posts: 4,358 Curl Connoisseur

    3a, some 2c & 3b, medium texture, porosity normal, low elasticity :-(
    washing/cowashing, conditioning, protein tx: curl junkie products
    leave in:curl junkie conditioners and treatments as leave in
    styling: curl junkie 
    sealants - jane carter nourish & shine
  • BluebloodBlueblood Registered Users Posts: 1,748 Curl Neophyte
    Here is a link on oils that penetrate the hair shaft linky

    The only oils guaranteed not to penetrate after being left on for a long time e.g. 12 hours are mineral oil, rice bran oil and jojoba oil.
  • Therese1Therese1 Registered Users Posts: 2,563 Curl Virtuoso
    Blueblood, thanks for the correction. I didn't realize that grapeseed oil would penetrate the hair (although it may have to be left on for some time).

    My original question might not have been phrased well. Based on the link from the Science-y Hair Blog (thanks, rbb!--this was the post I was thinking of when I asked the question), the best choices for an oil pre-poo would be oils that have a high penetration of the hair cuticle. This is to protect the innermost part of the hair by waterproofing it so that it doesn't swell with excess water. But I see other people using pre-poo oils that don't penetrate the hair well (grapeseed, for example). I'm wondering if using such an oil is getting at the problem in a different way: Does using a pre-poo oil of a less-penetrating variety prevent the hair from picking up water in the first place, as opposed to waterproofing the innermost part of the hair? Sorry if I'm not explaining myself very well.
    Low poo: Intelligent Nutrients (IN) Harmonic; Oribe Cleansing Creme
    RO: IN Harmonic
    LI: CJ Beauticurls; Jessicurl (JC) Gelebration Spray
    DC: JC Deep Conditioning Treatment; Weleda Rosemary Conditioning Oil
    Stylers: JC Confident Coils; IN Volumizing Spray; IN Perfect Hold Hairspray; John Masters Sea Mist; Bumble Bb. Gel; Kenra Firm-Hold Gel; Sevi Blue Yarrow Sea Salt Spray
    Low-porosity 2a/b baby-fine hair
  • Curlista93Curlista93 Registered Users Posts: 411 Curl Novice
    I prepoo with sealant oils and conditioner. I just do it because I feel like dirty hair helps prevent my hair from being stripped. If I shampoo on semi dirty hair then the shampoo has less dirt to remove and therefore sucks ALL of the remaining moisture from hair instead of dirt. The oil (but for me conditioner does a better job) also helps soften the hair and helps fight against brittleness from the shampoo. I don't have scientific evidence to back this up, this is just my theory and my experience.
    Kinky Curly, 4a, Fine Texture 
    Last Relaxer: 2/11/2012
    Latest BC: 11/24/2018


  • ttoosdayttoosday Registered Users Posts: 509 Curl Connoisseur
    Can someone clarify a little about something related to this? So it's highly recommended to prepoo with an oil to keep excessive water out. But that is a little confusing to me, because isn't hydrating all about getting water in? I understand we don't want to OVER hydrate so we stop using humectants and use anti humectants sometimes. But what if we NEED as much hydration as possible? It's confusing to me to use oil to repel water during washing when my hair is super duper dry. What am I missing?
    CG since 11/2014
    Mostly 2B, but ranges A-C front to back and root to tip
    Low density, very coarse, high porosity
    Collarbone length, gray dyed brown, dry and rough
    Typical LEG routine could be any combination of:
    Lo poo: Shea Moisture brand shampoo, Ion Hard Water Shampoo
    Cowash: As I Am Coc Cowash
    RO: GVP CB, Aussie Mega Moist, Not Your Mothers Gardenia
    Leave In: As I Am LI, KCKT, or Not Your Mothers Gardenia
    Enhancer: Camille Rose Curl Maker
    Deep condition: SM Deep Treat Mask
    Protein: Hask Keratin
    Styler: Curl Keeper Original, Ouidad Climate Control gel, LA Looks gel
  • rbbrbb Registered Users Posts: 4,358 Curl Connoisseur
    ttoosday wrote: »
    Can someone clarify a little about something related to this? So it's highly recommended to prepoo with an oil to keep excessive water out. But that is a little confusing to me, because isn't hydrating all about getting water in? I understand we don't want to OVER hydrate so we stop using humectants and use anti humectants sometimes. But what if we NEED as much hydration as possible? It's confusing to me to use oil to repel water during washing when my hair is super duper dry. What am I missing?

    i laughed out loud when i read your post. it's pretty much the nature of curly hair care -- CONFUSION! :confused:
    i don't pre-poo as my hair hates oils, before, during, after. i do seal after leave in with a butter product.

    i would just experiment and keep track of what your hair seemed to like. straight-haired have no idea of all the trial and error components to curly -- i shake my head when someone says to me, oh, curly hair must be so easy.

    but, i do love my hair and am willing to try to figure out what it likes as i feel great when my hair looks good.

    3a, some 2c & 3b, medium texture, porosity normal, low elasticity :-(
    washing/cowashing, conditioning, protein tx: curl junkie products
    leave in:curl junkie conditioners and treatments as leave in
    styling: curl junkie 
    sealants - jane carter nourish & shine
  • Curls80Curls80 Registered Users Posts: 526 Curl Connoisseur
    ttoosday wrote: »
    Can someone clarify a little about something related to this? So it's highly recommended to prepoo with an oil to keep excessive water out. But that is a little confusing to me, because isn't hydrating all about getting water in? I understand we don't want to OVER hydrate so we stop using humectants and use anti humectants sometimes. But what if we NEED as much hydration as possible? It's confusing to me to use oil to repel water during washing when my hair is super duper dry. What am I missing?

    My understanding (from reading posts and the sciencey hair blog specifically) is that porous hair can take on TOO much water, causing hygral fatigue, weakening hair etc, so a coconut oil (for example) pre-poo helps repair the hair shaft by being pushed deep within the hair, while at the same time preventing too much water from being absorbed. You get the benefits of coconut oil and the prevention of too much water being absorbed. And again, some people who don't like coconut oil can use others to get similar benefits I believe!

    Science-y Hair Blog: Oil Pre-Shampoo or Pre-Wash (And how to make it work for YOUR hair)
    3a/3b high porosity, mainly coarse, medium density
    Live in Canada- hot summers, freezing winters- dry dry dry
    As I am cleansing pudding, soultanicals deep condish, curlsmith cowash, lhdc condish 
    KCCC, curlsmith soufflé, ufdcm, mga sculpting gel 
    Scrunch with hair repear towel, then diffuse or air
    Protein- Cnpf
  • ttoosdayttoosday Registered Users Posts: 509 Curl Connoisseur
    I emailed goose to see if she could clarify from her "molecular" perspective. Prepooing is one of those things I do without knowing exactly how it works. I'm genuinely interested to know how the oil repels and allows water through at the same time.
    CG since 11/2014
    Mostly 2B, but ranges A-C front to back and root to tip
    Low density, very coarse, high porosity
    Collarbone length, gray dyed brown, dry and rough
    Typical LEG routine could be any combination of:
    Lo poo: Shea Moisture brand shampoo, Ion Hard Water Shampoo
    Cowash: As I Am Coc Cowash
    RO: GVP CB, Aussie Mega Moist, Not Your Mothers Gardenia
    Leave In: As I Am LI, KCKT, or Not Your Mothers Gardenia
    Enhancer: Camille Rose Curl Maker
    Deep condition: SM Deep Treat Mask
    Protein: Hask Keratin
    Styler: Curl Keeper Original, Ouidad Climate Control gel, LA Looks gel
  • Therese1Therese1 Registered Users Posts: 2,563 Curl Virtuoso
    My understanding is that when the hair is porous, the inner cortex takes on water too quickly, which causes it to swell, which in turn causes the cuticle on the outer part of the hair (the cuticle acts kind of like little shingles) to lift up, and then bits of it break off. That in turn causes the hair to be even more porous, because the outer covering has been compromised. If pre-poos are done with a penetrating oil (not just an oil that sits on top), the inner part of the hair can become waterproofed, so it won't swell so much in water and cause the cuticle to chip.
    Low poo: Intelligent Nutrients (IN) Harmonic; Oribe Cleansing Creme
    RO: IN Harmonic
    LI: CJ Beauticurls; Jessicurl (JC) Gelebration Spray
    DC: JC Deep Conditioning Treatment; Weleda Rosemary Conditioning Oil
    Stylers: JC Confident Coils; IN Volumizing Spray; IN Perfect Hold Hairspray; John Masters Sea Mist; Bumble Bb. Gel; Kenra Firm-Hold Gel; Sevi Blue Yarrow Sea Salt Spray
    Low-porosity 2a/b baby-fine hair
  • ttoosdayttoosday Registered Users Posts: 509 Curl Connoisseur
    Well that's my whole question - how much water can (or should) get through, and if the answer is none, then how are we "hydrating" at all? Where does the water reside in order to be hydrating, does it reside "in" the hair itself? And how does the water get to where needs to get if oil is repelling it? Also, I tend to make things very complicated.
    CG since 11/2014
    Mostly 2B, but ranges A-C front to back and root to tip
    Low density, very coarse, high porosity
    Collarbone length, gray dyed brown, dry and rough
    Typical LEG routine could be any combination of:
    Lo poo: Shea Moisture brand shampoo, Ion Hard Water Shampoo
    Cowash: As I Am Coc Cowash
    RO: GVP CB, Aussie Mega Moist, Not Your Mothers Gardenia
    Leave In: As I Am LI, KCKT, or Not Your Mothers Gardenia
    Enhancer: Camille Rose Curl Maker
    Deep condition: SM Deep Treat Mask
    Protein: Hask Keratin
    Styler: Curl Keeper Original, Ouidad Climate Control gel, LA Looks gel
  • chickittenchickitten Registered Users Posts: 90 Curl Neophyte
    ttoosday wrote: »
    Well that's my whole question - how much water can (or should) get through, and if the answer is none, then how are we "hydrating" at all? Where does the water reside in order to be hydrating, does it reside "in" the hair itself? And how does the water get to where needs to get if oil is repelling it? Also, I tend to make things very complicated.

    Btw, did Goose respond to your email? if she did, I'd love to know what her response was :). I'm pretty sure a coconut oil pre-wash doesn't prevent ALL water from getting get through, since we low poo/co-wash after the prepoo, the gentle surfactants (or ingredients that act like surfactants) present in the low poo/co-wash can rinse away any excess coconut oil the hair doesn't need and leave in just enough to still let water penetrate your hair. That's just my guestimate, I may be wrong though.
    :cat:
    2C/3A. med-high porosity. waist length. balayaged. LI - Curl Keeper - G.:duckie:
    My Faves
        [*]S: SM ABS. SM Manuka Honey. Ouidad Superfruit Clarifying[*]Condish: GVP Cond. Balm
        [*]Gel: CURL KEEPER! (alone or under the following:), LA LOOKS Sport/Mega
        [*]Cream: SM CES
        [*]LI: As I Am LI
        [*] PT: Aphogee 2-step (1x Month), ION EC (discont.)
      • SopottSopott Registered Users Posts: 42 Curl Neophyte
        Sorry I'm being dense: I still don't get it. I use a mix of coconut and olive oils as a pre-poo. I put it in my hair the evening before wash day. Should I put it into dry hair or dampen it first?
        2C/3A
        shampoo: Aubrey Organics Honeysuckle Rose
        conditioner: Aubrey Organics Island Naturals
        leave-in: Shea Moisture Coconut Hibiscus Curl Enhancing Smoothie
        sealing oil: olive, coconut, avocado
        gel: Deva

        alternating weeks
        protein: Aphogee 2 Minute Reconstructor
        moisture: Cantu Deep Treatment Masque
      • Curls80Curls80 Registered Users Posts: 526 Curl Connoisseur
        Sopott wrote: »
        Sorry I'm being dense: I still don't get it. I use a mix of coconut and olive oils as a pre-poo. I put it in my hair the evening before wash day. Should I put it into dry hair or dampen it first?

        Everything I've read on the subject says to put pre-poo oils in dry hair.
        3a/3b high porosity, mainly coarse, medium density
        Live in Canada- hot summers, freezing winters- dry dry dry
        As I am cleansing pudding, soultanicals deep condish, curlsmith cowash, lhdc condish 
        KCCC, curlsmith soufflé, ufdcm, mga sculpting gel 
        Scrunch with hair repear towel, then diffuse or air
        Protein- Cnpf

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