bras and dress codes

scrills

We have a situation here locally where a high school student was sent home for not wearing a bra. I believe that the official reason was a violation of dress code of skin showing ( I think her back may have been out as well ). I will add that the woman who sent the girl home was new.

The students are now staging a walk out/protest demanding that they get input on the dress code policy.

• what are your thoughts?
• Should high school students be forced to wear a bra? Should there be guidelines within the dress code just for this item? If so. what?
• Should the students have a say in the policy?
• One person noted that requiring women to wear a bra is promoting rape culture. Do you agree or disagree?

spiderlashes5000

I can't see the efficacy of forcing young girls to wear bras. But I'd have to see what she looked like and know how the dress code read before I could come on that particular case.

I would think that that's the reason for Student Council, to weigh in on policies such as these and others. I don't have a problem with asking students for input but ultimately the administration would have to make the final decision

Sent from my SCH-I605 using CurlTalk App

sixelamy

I would be more concerned with skin showing than I would be if there was a bra involved or not. No bra definitely looks better with open backs... unless it's cold and the shirt is tight.


If students had a say in the policy, they could come up with all kinds of things, that's pretty ridiculous - why have a policy then?


This particular case is a lose-lose. Open backs, bra or not, seem a bit trashy to me at that age for school. They need to revise their policy, but not just bra or no bra - clothing in general.

scrills

Dress code policy

https://s3.amazonaws.com/s3.documentcloud.org/documents/2289985/lakewood-dress-code.pdf

spiderlashes5000

That is a very extensive list of dos and donts (with a rather lofty purpose statement)! Prbly should have given the student a warning and a borrowed cardigan if this was her first "infraction," and add a few more specifics to the code if they want to cover all bases.

I do feel parents are often remiss in how they allow their kids (girls esp) to dress nowadays. I remember several times my father telling me to get back in the house and change when I was in jr high and high school bc I was wearing something he thought was inappropriate.

BelleBohemienne

I would say that this is a choice left up to the woman. If she feels she doesn't need to wear a bra then she shouldn't. I personally feel that there are some women, myself included, that should be a bit more covered because I find nipples and unregulated bouncing a bit much, but I do stand by a woman's right to choose to wear one. I known I choose not to if I don't have to.

Schools and workplaces, I feel, it is inappropriate to go without. Simply because these are suppose to be more professional environments and without a bra or support of some kind is unprofessional, in my opinion. In this case, it sounds more like the open back top was the issue than not wearing a bra at all because would you still ask this if the student were wearing a Polo shirt? See what I mean?

As far as promoting rape culture, that is a "blame the victim" response. No one asks to be raped. I don't care if a man or woman is walking around completely naked, they are still not asking to be raped.

~Belle Bohemienne

CurlyCanadian

BelleBohemienne wrote: »

I would say that this is a choice left up to the woman. If she feels she doesn't need to wear a bra then she shouldn't. I personally feel that there are some women, myself included, that should be a bit more covered because I find nipples and unregulated bouncing a bit much, but I do stand by a woman's right to choose to wear one. I known I choose not to if I don't have to.

Schools and workplaces, I feel, it is inappropriate to go without. Simply because these are suppose to be more professional environments and without a bra or support of some kind is unprofessional, in my opinion. In this case, it sounds more like the open back top was the issue than not wearing a bra at all because would you still ask this if the student were wearing a Polo shirt? See what I mean?

As far as promoting rape culture, that is a "blame the victim" response. No one asks to be raped. I don't care if a man or woman is walking around completely naked, they are still not asking to be raped.

~Belle Bohemienne

She's not a woman though. If people can tell you're not wearing a bra, you need to be wearing a bra. These are things teens/young women need to learn.

Backless is inappropriate for school. I think there should be some input from the students, ultimately not their decision though.

spiderlashes5000

BelleBohemienne wrote: »

As far as promoting rape culture, that is a "blame the victim" response. No one asks to be raped. I don't care if a man or woman is walking around completely naked, they are still not asking to be raped.

I think they are saying the opposite; that forcing female ppl to wear bras is tantamount to blaming the victim as in she is asking to be raped or harrassed by virtue of her immodest dress.

BelleBohemienne

spiderlashes5000 wrote: »

BelleBohemienne wrote: »

As far as promoting rape culture, that is a "blame the victim" response. No one asks to be raped. I don't care if a man or woman is walking around completely naked, they are still not asking to be raped.

I think they are saying the opposite; that forcing female ppl to wear bras is tantamount to blaming the victim as in she is asking to be raped or harrassed by virtue of her immodest dress.

That's exactly what I mean. That going without a bra is immodest and possibly sexual and men cannot help, but notice and become aroused and must release their frustration. It's an ignorant way of thinking.

~Belle Bohemienne

spiderlashes5000

BelleBohemienne wrote: »

spiderlashes5000 wrote: »

BelleBohemienne wrote: »

As far as promoting rape culture, that is a "blame the victim" response. No one asks to be raped. I don't care if a man or woman is walking around completely naked, they are still not asking to be raped.

I think they are saying the opposite; that forcing female ppl to wear bras is tantamount to blaming the victim as in she is asking to be raped or harrassed by virtue of her immodest dress.

That's exactly what I mean. That going without a bra is immodest and possibly sexual and men cannot help, but notice and become aroused and must release their frustration. It's an ignorant way of thinking.

~Belle Bohemienne

But aren't the protesters saying that forcing women/girls to wear bras supports that way of thinking? ^^^

Sent from my SCH-I605 using CurlTalk App

curlyarca

Nothing in there about undergarments...

Josephine

It's hard to enforce, but I think there should be some amount of support/coverage, some girls can do it with an undershirt, some need a bra.

It's hard to draw a line with dress and what is promoting rape culture. It definitely depends on what environment you're in.

wavypen

I think most dress codes for high school seem to be promoting rape culture/victim blaming by putting it on the girls to "dress appropriately", rather than expecting boys to learn to control their responses. I've also seen dress codes that target certain races (usually black people and usually in a stereotypical way). I think if controlling dress is so important then they should just have school uniforms.

spiderlashes5000

wavypen wrote: »

I think most dress codes for high school seem to be promoting rape culture/victim blaming by putting it on the girls to "dress appropriately", rather than expecting boys to learn to control their responses. I've also seen dress codes that target certain races (usually black people and usually in a stereotypical way). I think if controlling dress is so important then they should just have school uniforms.

Yes!! That the school would link any article of clothing to rape, is promoting a rape culture imo. And the protesters are calling the school on that. And yes, to target certain hairstyles and other superfluous stuff = racial discrimination.

It's sad that the schools need to assist parents so much w the tank of staffing their children appropriately.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using CurlTalk App

scrills

For those that people that dress codes promote rap culture, are you OK with girls wearing barely nothing to school?

eveum

I don't believe in rape culture. Men are not programmed to rape on the off chance that some bare skin is showing.

Open back shirts/dresses are straight up inappropriate for school and for work. I don't even know why this is a talking point. I think the to bra or not to bra is a more of a two sided debate for me. I can see why some women would not, for example if they are near flat chested and don't feel the need for one, or maybe they just feel more comfortable without. For me, I always bra, I would feel incredibly awkward not doing so and it would not look good at all. There are general dress codes for work (that obviously change from country to country) and that is the world we live in, If you're asked to a job interview there is a certain standard of dress that is expected of you, I don't have an issue with being expected to dress appropriately for the situation. It doesn't oppress me.

I live in the UK and school uniforms are the norm here (except college), I really think they're better in terms of feeling more equal to others. when I was of school age I dressed really poorly for my shape because I didn't know how to, on top of already being bullied I don't think I could have handled wearing my own clothes. I would have felt embarrassed.

spiderlashes5000

scrills wrote: »

For those that people that dress codes promote rap culture, are you OK with girls wearing barely nothing to school?

I don't think dress codes promote a rape culture; but policies that force girls to wear bras to supposedly prevent them from being raped do.

If anything, when ppl dress in a manner that is overly revealing or risqué, my concern is w/ their own priorities and perception of themselves; not that they are asking to be raped or that they are going to be raped.

I just think kids should dress in comfortable, simple attire for school, so they are not distracting themselves from the work at hand (e.g., if I wear this will he look at me, will she think I have money, will she think I'm tough, will they think I fit in, I don't want to scuff these shoes, I'm cold, this hurts, etc.)

BelleBohemienne

Teaching teens what is appropriate to where in different situations is always important, but I don't believe in forcing girls to wear certain undergarments because it's the "norm." If my daughter didn't want to shave or wear a bra then that's her choice. At a certain point, parents and other adults need to give teens room to figure out who they are.

"Rape Culture" is simply an ignorant conception to blame the victim for crimes the perpetrators commit. However, if you want to prevent crime....perhaps self defense courses should be a requirement for all girls and young ladies in school. Perhaps men won't mess with women if they knew those women could defend themselves.

~Belle Bohemienne

multicultcurly

Belle I agree with your post above. Teaching young men more effective ways to deal with their anger and feelings of inadequacies, as well as to view women as people and not as objects, would probably also lead to a decrease in rape.

Sent from my SPH-L710 using CurlTalk App

bringingcurliesback?

I think we should redefine the term distraction. I agree that I would want to see what she looked like but if it's a skin issue then nothing should have been said about her bra or lack of one. I agree it should be a personal choice. You're an amazing female unicorn that has the power to bleed without dying, produce humans, give and recieve pleasure with our bodies etc. but what we look like is an issue... um okay. That's ridiculous, my sister's high school has issues with simple tank tops. Let's get real about what we should put effort into. This year my siblings (one is a 15 year old girl and the other is a 10 year old boy) came home with their new school laptops. The school does a lot of school and homework online now... I freaking hate that too. Let's protest against those too lol.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I317 using CurlTalk App