So how tacky is Giuliana?

spiderlashes5000spiderlashes5000 Registered Users Posts: 17,898 Curl Virtuoso
Was it all in good fun or were her comments about Zendaya racially insensitive? Did Zendaya need to take it there w/ a response...or is it also sad she felt the need to justify her hairstyle? Does it matter if they were faux-locs?

Comments

  • CurlyCanadianCurlyCanadian Registered Users, Curl Ambassador Posts: 10,904 Curl Connoisseur
    I don't know anything about the comments, but she was by far the most stunning woman at the Oscars. That dress, the hair, all of it, just beautiful and so classy!
    I believe in manicures. I believe in overdressing. I believe in primping at leisure and wearing lipstick. I believe in pink. I believe that laughing is the best calorie burner. I believe in kissing, kissing a lot. I believe in being strong when everything seems to be going wrong. I believe that happy girls are the prettiest girls. I believe that tomorrow is another day and I believe in miracles.
    Audrey Hepburn
  • Fifi.GFifi.G Registered Users Posts: 15,490 Curl Neophyte
    I don't think her comments had anything to do with race. My first thoughts when I read her remarks were Bohemian/Hippy Chic. I also consider G's age. You could not throw a rock in the 90's without hitting a store that was largely staffed by people of every race, sporting DL's, bathed in patchouli and higher than a kite. One can get into specifics with hair styles (I personally view a large majority of styles as something worn by different people in different times) but there has not been one meaning/one group tied to weed, scented oils or even DL's (in America, since the 60's).
    When I hear terms like "hipster" I think, who told cliques they could leave high school??

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • spiderlashes5000spiderlashes5000 Registered Users Posts: 17,898 Curl Virtuoso
    Fifi.G wrote: »
    I don't think her comments had anything to do with race. My first thoughts when I read her remarks were Bohemian/Hippy Chic. I also consider G's age. You could not throw a rock in the 90's without hitting a store that was largely staffed by people of every race, sporting DL's, bathed in patchouli and higher than a kite. One can get into specifics with hair styles (I personally view a large majority of styles as something worn by different people in different times) but there has not been one meaning/one group tied to weed, scented oils or even DL's (in America, since the 60's).

    Fringe elements of other groups may wear locs but they started as a Black Caribbean tradition and are still mostly associated with Black ppl.

    But Giuliana did offer an apology so I'm happy about that. Classy thing to do.

  • kasdenkasden Registered Users Posts: 1,045 Curl Connoisseur
    She looks just like that chick on Avatar!

    2014-grammy-awards-giuliana-rancic.jpg

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  • sew and sewsew and sew Registered Users Posts: 3,443
    I'm not familiar with the general tone/candor on that show, but the statement itself seems really snarky and makes me think there was some jealousy involved. It definitely brings bohemians/hippies to mind though rather than skin color. I would think the mention of patchouli and weed would actually make that obvious.

    As an aside I just watched Rancic's apology and the way she talks about how it was a learning experience, "I learned a lot today"...that is absolutely formulaic with apologies for controversial statements taken as racist. For some taking it in...that's great, it's perfect. Everyone should put it that way. But it doesn't seem genuine to me (even if Rancic is genuine, and I think she is). While it may seem like a noble trend in society, how that's executed has a 'group-think reigns' oppressive side to it too. If I was her I would have apologized for the disrespect inherent in the words because that was due, but not flagellate myself at the altar of political correctness.
    “It was only a sunny smile and little it cost in the giving but like morning light it scattered the night and made the day worth living.” - F. Scott Fitzgerald

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  • spiderlashes5000spiderlashes5000 Registered Users Posts: 17,898 Curl Virtuoso
    It definitely brings bohemians/hippies to mind though rather than skin color. I would think the mention of patchouli and weed would actually make that obvious.

    I think the (stereotyped) association btwn locs and weed is much stronger w/ Jamaicans/Rastafarians/African Americans than "hippies." Locs is still primarily a Black hairstyle. I don't think anyone really found the patchouli part offensive. (I like patchouli!)

  • WildfoxWildfox Registered Users Posts: 148
    I think a big part of the issue was that at one point she praised or complimented Kylie Jenner for having dreadlocks (or faux locs I believe but still)
  • fraufrau Registered Users Posts: 6,130 Curl Neophyte
    I wasn't offended.
    Her hair could've looked better.
    It wasn't "dreadlocks" but her dreadlocks, imo.
  • scrillsscrills Registered Users Posts: 6,700
    Locs and patchouli = hippies

    If she would have just said locs, I would think differently. but patchouli reminds me of Berkley and makes me want to go to Haight aand Ashbury. I miss SF. you see tongue in cheek signs like this one all around

    hippies_use_back_door_sign.png

    I don't see it as racial. And its the whole point of a show like that snark?
  • CurlyMan82CurlyMan82 Registered Users Posts: 219 Curl Neophyte
    It's also noteworthy to mention that, when Kylie Jenner got dreadlocks, they were "edgy" to her

    tweet-ee54c37b8bcd4d7bb1795502b38894c0.jpg
  • CurlyMan82CurlyMan82 Registered Users Posts: 219 Curl Neophyte
    1zn9xfb.png

    Essentially, it's like saying dreadlocks with nappy hair have a negative vibe to them but dreadlocks with straight hair look great. At any rate, I don't know why anyone should care what she thinks. She just made the mistake of showing her prejudice. Guess it comes out when you least expect ;)
  • LayaliLayali Registered Users Posts: 561 Curl Connoisseur
    I do think the comment was racist. Black hair has been ridiculed and criticized since forever.

    If you wear dreadlocks, you're a weed smoking, good-for-nothing rasta.

    If you wear an afro, you are militant and anti-establishment. (Remember that New Yorker cover depicting a radical Michelle Obama with an afro)

    If you wear a weave/wig, you want to be white or you hate yourself.

    If you wear your hair in a natural state, it's "frizzy, unpolished and unprofessional"...oh, yes, a supervisor did say this to me (fyi, my hair is always neat and laid to the gawds, lol.)

    For a long time, unless your hair was chock full of chemicals or you spent 3 hours burning the ish out of it to straighten it, your black hair was not acceptable.

    One of the reasons why I love the natural hair movement is that this perception is changing, but every now and then ignorance does still rear it's ugly head a la Giuliana. However, I do think Zendaya handled it beautifully. 18 years old and she articulated her point in a classy, respectful, and mature manner. Well done.
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  • sew and sewsew and sew Registered Users Posts: 3,443
    I wonder if maybe people on the west coast understand the locs, patchouli, weed trifecta for it's bohemian/hippie connotation more readily.

    With patchouli being in there, I just don't understand, logically, why Rancic's own explanation that she had bohemians in mind is rejected.

    A lot of people have pointed out that someone out of the frame seems to have said "weed" (Kathy Griffin maybe) and Rancic repeated it. So if Rancic was actually leaving it at locs and patchouli (even though weed goes into the hippie trifecta perfectly), maybe the sense of racism would have been lessened...but it almost feels racist to say that! In other words, if you hear locs and weed you think black people. Well, that's not cool. But that was the thought process of the offended audience.

    The majority of people embracing that trifecta who I knew in college (there were still some stragglers in 'my time') happened to be white.
    “It was only a sunny smile and little it cost in the giving but like morning light it scattered the night and made the day worth living.” - F. Scott Fitzgerald

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  • curlyprincess1curlyprincess1 Registered Users Posts: 468
    Rancic is, well, watch what Sheryl said on The Talk!
    Zendaya is lovely. My kid loves watching her on t.v.
    It's not easy being a princess, but hey, if the crown fits.
  • DedachanDedachan Registered Users Posts: 1,644 Curl Neophyte
    Whether you think it's a racist attitude or not, I'd hesitate to call her a racist. People often absorb ideas without realizing the implications. A lot of people have not waken up to the fact that hair can also be a racial issue. I'm not saying they aren't wrong, but to label a person's entire character based on just one incident seems extreme to me.
  • spiderlashes5000spiderlashes5000 Registered Users Posts: 17,898 Curl Virtuoso
    I wonder if maybe people on the west coast understand the locs, patchouli, weed trifecta for it's bohemian/hippie connotation more readily.

    With patchouli being in there, I just don't understand, logically, why Rancic's own explanation that she had bohemians in mind is rejected.

    A lot of people have pointed out that someone out of the frame seems to have said "weed" (Kathy Griffin maybe) and Rancic repeated it. So if Rancic was actually leaving it at locs and patchouli (even though weed goes into the hippie trifecta perfectly), maybe the sense of racism would have been lessened...but it almost feels racist to say that! In other words, if you hear locs and weed you think black people. Well, that's not cool. But that was the thought process of the offended audience.

    The majority of people embracing that trifecta who I knew in college (there were still some stragglers in 'my time') happened to be white.

    I'm not from the West Coat but I understand the hippie connotation. And it's a White connotation. But Zendaya is not a White hippie; she's an African American woman wearing locs and she has a Black father who wears locs...which are a predominantly Black hairstyle.

    We don't know what Giuliana was thinking...but what came out was rife w/ racist implication.

    eta - But I do think GR said all the rights things in her apology and I do believe it was a learning moment (ie., you can't say everything to everyone...)

  • mustangbunnymustangbunny Registered Users Posts: 1,033
    I believe the person who said "weed" out of frame is Kelly Osbourne, who defended herself by saying she's friends with Zendaya.


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  • spiderlashes5000spiderlashes5000 Registered Users Posts: 17,898 Curl Virtuoso
    I believe the person who said "weed" out of frame is Kelly Osbourne, who defended herself by saying she's friends with Zendaya.

    I thought Kelly said she did NOT say "weed" and would quit the show in protest if reporters continued to attribute "weed" to her...:tongue7:

  • mustangbunnymustangbunny Registered Users Posts: 1,033
    Oh did she? I should obviously have just shut my mouth because I clearly don't know! 😣


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  • Fifi.GFifi.G Registered Users Posts: 15,490 Curl Neophyte
    As an aside I just watched Rancic's apology and the way she talks about how it was a learning experience, "I learned a lot today"...that is absolutely formulaic with apologies for controversial statements taken as racist. For some taking it in...that's great, it's perfect. Everyone should put it that way. But it doesn't seem genuine to me (even if Rancic is genuine, and I think she is). While it may seem like a noble trend in society, how that's executed has a 'group-think reigns' oppressive side to it too. If I was her I would have apologized for the disrespect inherent in the words because that was due, but not flagellate myself at the altar of political correctness.

    Love this! I rarely find an apology to be sincere anymore, even if the person truly may be. It's all a standard formula used all too often because people pick every statement apart until there is nothing left. I watched an apology compilation video one day and could not stop laughing. I am sorry, sorry, truly sorry, on behalf of ... we apologize, sorry, very sorry. I wanted someone to scream I'm not sorry!! 99.9% of the statements were things that could be taken numerous different ways or had to be seriously read into to reach the apology worthy verdict. It's time to stop and reflect when I'm sorry no longer means anything. I think this is a very unfortunate overly PC side effect with a dash of social media mentality. It's become sport to dissect every sentence.

    @ Scrills... And the sign said long haired, freaky people need not apply. ;) Yes. The show is mostly snark but Joan would have never apologized. She valued FoS too much. I even admired her when she made horrible jokes about the Holocaust and refused to apologize. She was Jewish. We generally give people a pass on political/historical/stereotypical jokes or derogatory statements about their own.
    When I hear terms like "hipster" I think, who told cliques they could leave high school??

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Fifi.GFifi.G Registered Users Posts: 15,490 Curl Neophyte
    I wonder if maybe people on the west coast understand the locs, patchouli, weed trifecta for it's bohemian/hippie connotation more readily.

    With patchouli being in there, I just don't understand, logically, why Rancic's own explanation that she had bohemians in mind is rejected.

    A lot of people have pointed out that someone out of the frame seems to have said "weed" (Kathy Griffin maybe) and Rancic repeated it. So if Rancic was actually leaving it at locs and patchouli (even though weed goes into the hippie trifecta perfectly), maybe the sense of racism would have been lessened...but it almost feels racist to say that! In other words, if you hear locs and weed you think black people. Well, that's not cool. But that was the thought process of the offended audience.

    The majority of people embracing that trifecta who I knew in college (there were still some stragglers in 'my time') happened to be white.

    I have in Hillbilly-Ville, East Coast, USA and understand that perfectly. I have always seen more white people with DL's than anyone else. I'm am sure there are areas in the USA where it's the oppisite but as an American Standard, I think DL/Patchouli/Weed = Bohemian or Hippy, which can technically include anyone. Lenny K is A hippy. Lisa B is a hippy. The Occupy Meme Girl is a hippy. Counting Crows Front Man = Hippy. Go home hippies!! (Just kidding). I don't see it as anything bad. I've known some rather great people opposed to beauty standards and consuming animal products.

    ETA: I think different ideas can also contribute to this. You had so many eras in this country that were about separation or sharing. America is called "The Melting Pot" for a reason. Now there is a lot of emphasis on separation which is why you have discussions on Miley being allowed to Twerk or should white people play the banjo or wear mohawks? Mohawks being based on he theory that no one else spiked their hair (false), Banjo's due to the theory that they came from Africa, etc. My father was taught to play the banjo at 8 years old, by his mother, who told him the instrument came from Africa. She taught him the history of the instrument, as she heard it, before the music. It is said fiddles/violins come from Scotland BUT there are also 5 different theories for each. I think it gets a bit tricky, due to the melting pot, when you try to restrict or associate something to one group only. You also get differing POV due to the time you were raised in. I could not begin to associate DL/Oil & Puff, puff pass with one racial makeup (or in all seriousness take any one part or all combined as something truly insulting) That seems strange to me.
    When I hear terms like "hipster" I think, who told cliques they could leave high school??

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • multicultcurlymulticultcurly Registered Users Posts: 5,136 Curl Connoisseur
    I didn't yet read through this thread. Not sure how Zendaya racially identifies but Giuliana wasn't referencing race but the bohemian chic look of the 90s and 00s. I agree with Fifi's first comment.

    Apparently it bothered Zendaya so she said something. What she said was true and relevant. Locs have generally become an acceptable look for professional black women and men, but if you don't look the part, then the stereotype is you must be a pothead or a criminal. That's sad that someone Giuluana's age and career would even think that or be stupid enough to say it publicly.

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  • Fifi.GFifi.G Registered Users Posts: 15,490 Curl Neophyte
    I didn't yet read through this thread. Not sure how Zendaya racially identifies but Giuliana wasn't referencing race but the bohemian chic look of the 90s and 00s. I agree with Fifi's first comment.

    Apparently it bothered Zendaya so she said something. What she said was true and relevant. Locs have generally become an acceptable look for professional black women and men, but if you don't look the part, then the stereotype is you must be a pothead or a criminal. That's sad that someone Giuluana's age and career would even think that or be stupid enough to say it publicly.

    Sent from my SPH-L710 using CurlTalk App

    I don't see why locs would not be accepted professionally. It's just hair, damn it! I dated a vegan painter in the 90's who had loc's and was against drug use of any type, form or fashion. He broke up with me because I drank. I did drink a lot in the 90s BUT I think G's comment was on point with the theme of the show. It's not something you can take too seriously. Just like Joans old comments about women wearing dresses with white, stiff, itchy looking ruffles at the bottom looking like they need to get some vagisil. :-/ Haha. Not really but most can relate to clothes that make you want to scratch. I don't think anyone on the show now can pull it off the way she did, though.
    When I hear terms like "hipster" I think, who told cliques they could leave high school??

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • multicultcurlymulticultcurly Registered Users Posts: 5,136 Curl Connoisseur
    I guess you didn't read my comment. IME, locs are professionally acceptable for black men and women. I personally don't have an issue with locs that are well kept for anyone of any ethnicity. I do get your point of the show. If that's the case, then the comments make sense for the show. However I don't see Giuluana as an appropriate replacement for Joan Rivers. Kathy Griffin fits better. Joan wouldn't have apologized. People do get sensitive when you run down their appearance but considering where the comment was made, then it makes more sense.

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  • Fifi.GFifi.G Registered Users Posts: 15,490 Curl Neophyte
    I guess you didn't read my comment. IME, locs are professionally acceptable for black men and women. I personally don't have an issue with locs that are well kept for anyone of any ethnicity. I do get your point of the show. If that's the case, then the comments make sense for the show. However I don't see Giuluana as an appropriate replacement for Joan Rivers. Kathy Griffin fits better. Joan wouldn't have apologized. People do get sensitive when you run down their appearance but considering where the comment was made, then it makes more sense.

    Sent from my SPH-L710 using CurlTalk App

    I did read it and undserstand that and it is a valid point. I was just saying I do not get the fuss with "professional" hair styles in general. I always appreciated areas that were way ahead of their 20+ years ago. Someone in professional dress with any type of hair style imaginable, that some would consider unprofessional or strange, were not even look at twice. It's sad that it has not caught on in more places. What is in your head is more important than what is on it.

    It is a rather snarky show. You have to take it all with a grain of salt and the understanding that it's some playful poking and banter over award show fashion. She should not try to fill the shoes of Joan. I didn't even watch FP this time but I did see the red carpet coverage and many were coming off more snotty. They lack the comedic timing, and the stand up record/chops that you have to have, which makes all the difference. Whats her face... Khloe K was coming across as nothing more than a nasty mean girl. She was twirling her hair the whole time and being mad that no one else was slamming as many people as was.
    When I hear terms like "hipster" I think, who told cliques they could leave high school??

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Fifi.GFifi.G Registered Users Posts: 15,490 Curl Neophyte
    I couldn't quite figure out if she was using the red carpet coverage as an audition for Joans spot on TFP (completely seperate shows) or what. It wasn't working.

    *The name of the show knd of says it all. There will be crimes on The Fashion Police. Some will be exonerated, some will be persecuted, some will be victims, etc. most of the time they are talking about people they know and like. I guess, in a way, it's like (or was like) the SNL President or Presidential Candidates skits. Some get upset over those and some see it as an honor to be poked by SNL. Flaws and fumbles are exagerated but it's not meant to a deep reflection.
    When I hear terms like "hipster" I think, who told cliques they could leave high school??

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • spiderlashes5000spiderlashes5000 Registered Users Posts: 17,898 Curl Virtuoso
    Both Kelly Osborne and Kathy Griffin have now quit Fashion Police, both saying they no longer feel comfortable w/ the brand of humor the show espouses.

  • DedachanDedachan Registered Users Posts: 1,644 Curl Neophyte
    It's been maybe 3 years since I have last watched E! (I no longer have cable) but it bothered me how all their female "reporters" were very, very skinny and they all looked alike...and then you put these women, who have been pressured to look this way, to make mean comments about other women in the media...it doesn't sit well with me. The whole thing is very toxic. Good for Kelly Osborne and Kathy Griffin for speaking out.

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