Best time to SOTC?

naturecatnaturecat Posts: 1,986Registered Users Curl Neophyte
Hi,

I know most people seem to wait until their hair is dry to SOTC. Then on youtube, I saw this gal:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLsFfu09Nf4

And she mentions she SOTC before hair is dry, after gel cast has formed, to let warmer air reach damp hair. That sounded like the answer to my hair drying woes (takes a long time when covered in product). I tried it a bit today but went out and messed it up and didn't put enough gel = not pretty… soooo…. maybe I need to try again. Just curious, when do you SOTC? And have any of you ever tried it before hair is dry?

3A/f/i
Super baby fine hair, low porosity
Shampoos: SM Fruit Fusion (mostly), Avalon lemon (to clarify). Occasional aloe vera and glycerin to wash.
Stylers: Intelligent Nutrients Perfect Hold Hairspray
Treatments: Catnip tea, IA girl's PT, Fermented Rice Water, Catnip Tea, Amla tea, Irish Moss, SS PT

Comments

  • KaZenner1990KaZenner1990 Posts: 859Registered Users
    I have resulted on not SOTC at all as even with dry hair my definition seems to drop and also my hair becomes frizzy very fast. As well I get a gel.cast only on my canopy.

    {Stats for mobiles}
    M/C, High Porosity,Normal Elast. 2c/3a Boticelli/Corkicelli
    2C/3A Botticelli/Corkicelli.Growing out color/heat damage
    M/C, Low/Medium/High Por, Normal Elast. Medium Density
    LP: INSIGHT DAMAGED HAIR Restructurizing Shampoo
    CO: Generic protein conditioner, Hair Academy Deep Cleansing CO
    DET/RO/LI: GNC Avocado And Shea Butter Conditioner +/mask,
    Styler: Schwarzkopf Taft Fixing GelWellaflex Instant Volume Boost Mousse
    DT: EVOO, C.O
    HG
    Goal: WL when curly
    CG since Feb 2014
  • CurliniCurlini Posts: 258Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    As with all things CG the best time to SOTC is a matter of experimenting and finding out what works best for you. I definitely get better definition if I wait until my hair is completely dry. If I SOTC before it's dry my hair tends to be poufier and less defined. I've read that SOTC before your hair is dry can promote frizz - I haven't noticed this so much as the effect on definition.
    I have to admit that waiting for my hair to air dry can take several hours and it's often tempting to SOTC prematurely - but again, for me it's worth waiting.
    Good luck!
    Medium Texture/Normal Porosity
    Conditioners: Curl Junkie conditioners, Elucence moisture balancing, Darcy's pumpkin seed, Mop Top Daily
    Gels: CJ Pattern Pusha, CJ Curl Queen, UFDCM, Mop Top Curly Custard, KCCC (wish it didn't take so long to dry!), CJ Aloe Fix Lite
    Weekly PT (CJ Repair Me) & DT
    Icequeen method
    CG since Aug. 08, still a lot to learn

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • sixelamysixelamy Posts: 4,157Registered Users Curl Novice
    It's whatever your preference is, really. I always SOTC right before my hair is dry. Mainly because I'm impatient and don't like looking like I have plastic hair for more than half the day at work. It works for me and doesn't cause frizz unless I play too much.
    2c-3a - med-coarse - normal-high porosity - high density
    :bunny:
    NP/LP: CJ Daily Fix, KMF Whenever / Giovanni TTTT
    RO/LI: Aussie Moist, CJ Argan & Olive Oil, Hask Keratin Protein
    DC/PROTEIN: KC Stellar Strands / CNPF
    STYLER: CJ Curl Queen
    COLOR: henna, amla & indigo
    :thumbdown:: glycerin in high/low dews, polyquat-10 & 11, parabens
  • naturecatnaturecat Posts: 1,986Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Thanks for your replies, keep em coming. :) I wonder if I SOTC a bit prematurely, then applied more product, if that would help dry faster and prevent frizz (but if applying more product that might defeat the whole purpose of SOTC)? Perhaps I got frizz not from not putting enough product on, but SOTC prematurely. I went out for a walk and by the time I got back, I was sporting the put my hand in electrical socket look.

    3A/f/i
    Super baby fine hair, low porosity
    Shampoos: SM Fruit Fusion (mostly), Avalon lemon (to clarify). Occasional aloe vera and glycerin to wash.
    Stylers: Intelligent Nutrients Perfect Hold Hairspray
    Treatments: Catnip tea, IA girl's PT, Fermented Rice Water, Catnip Tea, Amla tea, Irish Moss, SS PT
  • StarmieStarmie Posts: 7,169Registered Users Curl Virtuoso
    I do it when my hair's dry, if I do it before it's properly dry I get frizz. My hair is very prone to frizz at the best of times though.
    3b in South Australia.
  • BotticelliBritBotticelliBrit Posts: 2,075Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    I normally SOTC when my hair is about 90% dry. So it may be slightly damp in some areas. Mostly I do it because I'm really impatient. It doesn't seem to make a different either way though.

    I'm not sure about scrunching it out when it's still pretty wet . . . I think that might frizz me up!
    3B. Med porosity. Med thickness. Med density.

    LP: Shea Moisture (currently JBCO)
    Conditioner/CW: Jason Aloe Vera

    LI: Aunt Jackie's Curls & Coils Quench
    Refreshing: TRESemmé Naturals Aloe Vera & Avocado
    Gel: DevaCurl Ultra Defining Gel
    DC:
    Aunt Jackie's Soft & Sassy Super Duper Softening Conditioner
    Treatments: Coconut oil/Coconut milk

    UK curly. CG since Oct 2013.
    Growing my hair to WL when dry :thumright:
  • SereneCurlsSereneCurls Posts: 1,145Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    I'm another who loses definition if I SOTC before my hair's completely dry. It is incredibly annoying to wait that long, but such is life. :)
    3a, dense, fairly coarse, normal porosity and elasticity, just below shoulder
    Low poo: Giovanni 50 50
    Co-wash: aia, suave coconut, salon care
    R O: Tresume Naturals, gvpcb
    L I: KCKT, gvpcb
    Stylers: cjpp, re : coil, kccc, brhg
    Oils: coconut, argan
    Experimenting with: curls rock amplifier, pantene mousse
  • CGSince2002CGSince2002 Posts: 1,073Banned Users
    I've tried it a few times when running out of time and it's usually not very good... But I think the last time I just had to reapply a bit of LI or gel (can't remember...) on the rogue curls but the rest survived. But the truth is that I usually don't SOTC like everyone else does, that seems to give me frizz. What I do, which will seem counter-intuitive, is twist all my hair together tight while bending down from the waist and then letting it loose, next I fluff the hair at the roots to get a little volume before straightening up.
    Joined Curltalk 1st time in early '02 shortly after starting CG. I'm a non-practicing Cosmetologist.
    Hair: color-treated, mostly 3A.
    CO-wash: VO5 K&L
    RO: SpaHaus Salon w/OO, VO5 Shea Cashmere, W.R. Trop. Coconut, Daily Defense Moisturizing & others.
    LI: Beautiful Curls w/Shea Butter & C.O., Hollywood Beauty OO Creme, VO5 K&L, Aveda Be Curly Curl Enhancer.
    Gels: LAL Wet Look, ORS Lock & Twist.
    Oils: Jojoba, EVCO & Africa's Best Ultimate Herbal Oil

  • naturecatnaturecat Posts: 1,986Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    I've tried it a few times when running out of time and it's usually not very good... But I think the last time I just had to reapply a bit of LI or gel (can't remember...) on the rogue curls but the rest survived. But the truth is that I usually don't SOTC like everyone else does, that seems to give me frizz. What I do, which will seem counter-intuitive, is twist all my hair together tight while bending down from the waist and then letting it loose, next I fluff the hair at the roots to get a little volume before straightening up.

    interesting. initially I'd done more of a massage to SOTC. after more PTs I find that I can handle scrunching more now. the twist sounds good too… more efficient maybe, because I find I miss pieces. also will try your "in a rush" technique when pressed for time. I ran out of the house SOTC with wet hair and didn't reapply product… and that was my curliest hair day ever maybe, I was creeping up on 3a! But it ended in catastrophe due to my sketchy technique. Ah well, every day is fresh with no mistakes and more PTs to try. ;)

    3A/f/i
    Super baby fine hair, low porosity
    Shampoos: SM Fruit Fusion (mostly), Avalon lemon (to clarify). Occasional aloe vera and glycerin to wash.
    Stylers: Intelligent Nutrients Perfect Hold Hairspray
    Treatments: Catnip tea, IA girl's PT, Fermented Rice Water, Catnip Tea, Amla tea, Irish Moss, SS PT
  • anissafersureanissafersure Posts: 255Registered Users
    For me, I don't do it at all. After I wash my hair and apply product, I let my hair air dry (which takes about 2 1/2 hours). Then I pineapple it when it's completely dry. Once I wake up in the morning, the gel cast is gone because the curls are softened from me sleeping on them. So sleeping just does all of the work for me, haha. In case you were wondering what gel I use, it's DevaCurl's Ultra Defining Gel.
  • naturecatnaturecat Posts: 1,986Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    For me, I don't do it at all. After I wash my hair and apply product, I let my hair air dry (which takes about 2 1/2 hours). Then I pineapple it when it's completely dry. Once I wake up in the morning, the gel cast is gone because the curls are softened from me sleeping on them. So sleeping just does all of the work for me, haha. In case you were wondering what gel I use, it's DevaCurl's Ultra Defining Gel.

    Oh, I've heard of other curlies SOTC in their sleep. Nice way to multi-task, heheh. So you don't use anything other than friction to SOTC either then. I've always just used my hands. Some folks here use product, but I can't imagine doing that without weighing down my hair.

    3A/f/i
    Super baby fine hair, low porosity
    Shampoos: SM Fruit Fusion (mostly), Avalon lemon (to clarify). Occasional aloe vera and glycerin to wash.
    Stylers: Intelligent Nutrients Perfect Hold Hairspray
    Treatments: Catnip tea, IA girl's PT, Fermented Rice Water, Catnip Tea, Amla tea, Irish Moss, SS PT
  • anissafersureanissafersure Posts: 255Registered Users
    naturecat wrote: »
    For me, I don't do it at all. After I wash my hair and apply product, I let my hair air dry (which takes about 2 1/2 hours). Then I pineapple it when it's completely dry. Once I wake up in the morning, the gel cast is gone because the curls are softened from me sleeping on them. So sleeping just does all of the work for me, haha. In case you were wondering what gel I use, it's DevaCurl's Ultra Defining Gel.

    Oh, I've heard of other curlies SOTC in their sleep. Nice way to multi-task, heheh. So you don't use anything other than friction to SOTC either then. I've always just used my hands. Some folks here use product, but I can't imagine doing that without weighing down my hair.

    Yep, pretty much! Haha (: It gives me the best results. If I do it myself, my hair gets all frizzy and I end up losing curl definition. The only time that I physically SOTC is when I find curls that have become extra frizzy to where I wet it, apply gel, re-curl it, and once it dries I'll scrunch it since it's kind of hard. But that's about it!
  • CGSince2002CGSince2002 Posts: 1,073Banned Users
    naturecat wrote: »
    I've tried it a few times when running out of time and it's usually not very good... But I think the last time I just had to reapply a bit of LI or gel (can't remember...) on the rogue curls but the rest survived. But the truth is that I usually don't SOTC like everyone else does, that seems to give me frizz. What I do, which will seem counter-intuitive, is twist all my hair together tight while bending down from the waist and then letting it loose, next I fluff the hair at the roots to get a little volume before straightening up.

    interesting. initially I'd done more of a massage to SOTC. after more PTs I find that I can handle scrunching more now. the twist sounds good too… more efficient maybe, because I find I miss pieces. also will try your "in a rush" technique when pressed for time. I ran out of the house SOTC with wet hair and didn't reapply product… and that was my curliest hair day ever maybe, I was creeping up on 3a! But it ended in catastrophe due to my sketchy technique. Ah well, every day is fresh with no mistakes and more PTs to try. ;)

    I forgot to mention that before doing the twisting I usually rub a couple of drops of (preferably jojoba) oil on my palms, particularly important during the cold months, that seems to eliminate any friction that could disturb my curls.

    How exciting to see some 3a action going on, looks like your hair is reaching for its full curling potential!
    :thumbup:
    Joined Curltalk 1st time in early '02 shortly after starting CG. I'm a non-practicing Cosmetologist.
    Hair: color-treated, mostly 3A.
    CO-wash: VO5 K&L
    RO: SpaHaus Salon w/OO, VO5 Shea Cashmere, W.R. Trop. Coconut, Daily Defense Moisturizing & others.
    LI: Beautiful Curls w/Shea Butter & C.O., Hollywood Beauty OO Creme, VO5 K&L, Aveda Be Curly Curl Enhancer.
    Gels: LAL Wet Look, ORS Lock & Twist.
    Oils: Jojoba, EVCO & Africa's Best Ultimate Herbal Oil

  • CurlyDiva71CurlyDiva71 Posts: 130Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    I SOTC after my hair is dry. Before I went CG, I would SOTC when my hair was about half dry, and then again when it was dry. I actually had pretty good curl definition from doing it that way, but haven't tried it since going CG, because I didn't want my hair to frizz. And I always had frizz, so I don't know if it was from sulfates/cones, or from scrunching when it was damp.
    I am gonna revisit this. My hair is so fine I am wondering if SOTC while damp would help me retain definition. Sometimes my hair looks awesome right after I put in my products and scrunch, but then after it dries and I SOTC, it doesn't look as good. I'm thinking the weight of the water in my hair might pull out the curl.

    3A, a mix of boticelli, corkicelli, and a few s-waves, baby fine, naturally porous, medium/high density

    Pre-poo: coconut oil
    Co-wash: TJ's Tea Tree Tingle, Sauve Naturals, VO5, As I Am coconut co-wash
    Conditioner: TJ's Nourish, Tresseme Naturals, Sauve Naturals coconut, SM Coconut & Hibiscus
    LI: KCKT
    Styling: DevaCurl Light Defining Gel, HETT Mousse (HG's!)
    EcoStyler Krystal (new HG!!!), BRHG
    coconut oil or jojoba oil to SOTC
    Color treated with demi-permanent color to cover first grays
  • CGSince2002CGSince2002 Posts: 1,073Banned Users
    I SOTC after my hair is dry. Before I went CG, I would SOTC when my hair was about half dry, and then again when it was dry. I actually had pretty good curl definition from doing it that way, but haven't tried it since going CG, because I didn't want my hair to frizz. And I always had frizz, so I don't know if it was from sulfates/cones, or from scrunching when it was damp.
    I am gonna revisit this. My hair is so fine I am wondering if SOTC while damp would help me retain definition. Sometimes my hair looks awesome right after I put in my products and scrunch, but then after it dries and I SOTC, it doesn't look as good. I'm thinking the weight of the water in my hair might pull out the curl.

    I think it's worth revisiting as you said. I've noticed that my own hair is less prone to frizz when it's been "well fed" with proteins and moisturizers. Like on Sunday, it was hot and humid but even though the gel I had on was simply unflavored gelatin dissolved in water at not even a heavy concentration, I went out and was looking at plants at the Lowe's nursery where you could feel the "steam" hit you when you got out of the a/c'd part. I thought I'd come home with a "nice" halo of frizz but my hair was intact. :iconbiggrin:

    I remember another time many years ago not long after starting CG but long enough to have given my moderately damaged hair a lot of TLC, I went out on a rainy day (in S. FL) and even got sprinkled and my curls, which looked beautiful that day, didn't flinch either. I know not all types of hair can expect the same results when their hair is well moisturized but I believe most types probably can.
    Joined Curltalk 1st time in early '02 shortly after starting CG. I'm a non-practicing Cosmetologist.
    Hair: color-treated, mostly 3A.
    CO-wash: VO5 K&L
    RO: SpaHaus Salon w/OO, VO5 Shea Cashmere, W.R. Trop. Coconut, Daily Defense Moisturizing & others.
    LI: Beautiful Curls w/Shea Butter & C.O., Hollywood Beauty OO Creme, VO5 K&L, Aveda Be Curly Curl Enhancer.
    Gels: LAL Wet Look, ORS Lock & Twist.
    Oils: Jojoba, EVCO & Africa's Best Ultimate Herbal Oil

  • guineapigsrcuteguineapigsrcute Posts: 64Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    I actually don't SOTC at all. I put a lot of product in on day 1 and let it be crunchy the first day so that I can get 2nd and 3rd day hair. Sleeping on it just gets rid of the crunch and you can get a style that lasts longer.
  • Morgan_AdcockMorgan_Adcock Posts: 2,573Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    You can, of course, do whatever you want, but it really isn't true that you can do whatever you want and call it CG. Well, I guess you can call anything you want CG, but that doesn't make it CG.

    Lorraine Massey advises to SOTC _after_ you hair dries, in order to avoid frizz; and that works. SOTCing (ETA before your hair dries) really does increase frizz.

    FWIW, I strongly recommend the book, Curly Girl: The Handbook (also available here).
    Peace,
    Morgan

    Baby Fine 3B, low porosity, normal density and elasticity
    CGing since July 2008
  • Morgan_AdcockMorgan_Adcock Posts: 2,573Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    IMO, it's not friction which SOTCs in your sleep, but pressure.
    Peace,
    Morgan

    Baby Fine 3B, low porosity, normal density and elasticity
    CGing since July 2008
  • CGSince2002CGSince2002 Posts: 1,073Banned Users
    You can, of course, do whatever you want, but it really isn't true that you can do whatever you want and call it CG. Well, I guess you can call anything you want CG, but that doesn't make it CG.

    Lorraine Massey advises to SOTC _after_ you hair dries, in order to avoid frizz; and that works. SOTCing really does increase frizz.

    FWIW, I strongly recommend the book, Curly Girl: The Handbook (also available here).

    In the beginning I used to be quite "religious" about CG, but the whole point is not to promote a "one-size-fits-all" approach to treating so many different types of hair but to teach what works best for most. CG stands for Curly Girl, a person who has embraced her curls, the method is just what helps a great number of us to do just that.

    The basics of the routine is what really make it "CG", like not using 'cones and, therefore, sulfate shampoos, for the wavies who seem to need a shampoo at all; the techniques are there IMO as guidelines, not commandments.

    After 12 years of starting I suppose a modified CG I have changed things around a bit every so often, sometimes even forgetting how it was in the book, then if it wasn't working I'd dig out the book and go back to what was there if it could give me the results I wanted.
    But if someone doesn't SOTC when completely dry (even if they don't get frizz), or does it differently like I do, or they don't clip their hair like it's in the book, or they diffuse differently... frankly, I don't think L.M. would object to anyone adapting her guidelines (since most of the credit goes to her anyway).
    Joined Curltalk 1st time in early '02 shortly after starting CG. I'm a non-practicing Cosmetologist.
    Hair: color-treated, mostly 3A.
    CO-wash: VO5 K&L
    RO: SpaHaus Salon w/OO, VO5 Shea Cashmere, W.R. Trop. Coconut, Daily Defense Moisturizing & others.
    LI: Beautiful Curls w/Shea Butter & C.O., Hollywood Beauty OO Creme, VO5 K&L, Aveda Be Curly Curl Enhancer.
    Gels: LAL Wet Look, ORS Lock & Twist.
    Oils: Jojoba, EVCO & Africa's Best Ultimate Herbal Oil

  • Morgan_AdcockMorgan_Adcock Posts: 2,573Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Like I said, people can do whatever they want. However, CG stands for the book, Curly Girl: The Handbook, which isn't at all one size fits all. There are a lot of different permutations of Lorraine Masey's method in the book, which she worked out by using and adapting it to many different types of curls and hair.
    Peace,
    Morgan

    Baby Fine 3B, low porosity, normal density and elasticity
    CGing since July 2008
  • LavenderNailsLavenderNails Posts: 12Registered Users
    I also don't SOTC and instead just sleep on it. I tend to do my hair in the evening so I let my hair completely air dry, put it in a loose ponytail while it's still hard, and sleep.

    The next morning the majority of the crunch is gone and usually there's only a little bit that I have to scrunch out and I'm good to go. It's also great cuz I don't have to fuss with my hair too much in morning.
    3b - medium texture/ normal to high porosity/ medium density/ color treated

    Shampoo - SM African Water Mint Shampoo/ Aussie Most Shampoo
    RO/DC - Aussie Moist(HG)/ SM High Porosity Moisture Seal Masque
    LI - Giovanni LI/ Mixed Chicks LI/ Ouidad Whipped Curls/ SM JBCO Strengthen and Grow LI
    Styler - LAL Sport Gel/ LAL Mega Mega Hold Gel/ Ouidad Climate Control Gel (HG)/ TIGI Curls Rock Amplifier(HG)/ Lusti Naturals Twist and Lock Gel

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