My hair is a MESS!

mlleelisemlleelise Posts: 25Registered Users Curl Neophyte
Thanks for the tips...but I am thoroughly FRUSTRATED. My hair is baby fine and goes every which way. Today I tried cowashing with VO5 Naturals lavender conditioner, then used Curly Girl Knot Today as a LI, then used Flaxseed Gel on sopping wet hair. I scrunched & scrunched with an aquis towel, getting alot of water out.
THEN I used AG Moisture foam (mouse) sparingly; scrunching scrunching. then used the pixie method of diffusing til nearly dry. Lots of crazy individual curls. When thoroughly dry, I used a tiny bit of the shea moisture cream to get rid of the scrunchiness - but THIS is what I'm left with! A HOT MESS!!!
There's no rhyme or reason to the way my hair goes. I've attached a few photos below...As you can see, I have a HUGE cowlick at my crown at the back...it goes nearly half way down my head! Virtually every hair on top is doing a forward swirling thing - the opposite direction of where I'd LIKE it to go. I'm forcing it to go backwards, which makes it lump up at the crown.
No clumping ever happens - no matter how much I squeeze it when it's wet. Just whispy wayward waves, with a mind of their own.
WHAT SHOULD I DO?? Should I give up until the layers grow out? At 60, I really don't like my hair to look so unkempt. HELP!! :sad3:

Comments

  • BluebloodBlueblood Posts: 1,748Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    You need to make ONE change at a time not all at once. Whether that change is a product or a method.

    Then you need to give the change 5-7 days to see if it works and if it's not working you need to try and work out why before changing it again.
  • rbbrbb Posts: 4,350Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    i actually like the first picture, think it looks good!
    what i would recommend is a haircut -- just a trim -- that will shape it better, make it flow better. very long layers.
    my hair also grows forward, i just side part it and that seems to keep it happy.

    i do not know, but i think fine, wavy hair might do better with low poo more often instead of cowashing? give it a try. kc knot today is not very moisturizing. and, i found the aquis towel to make my hair frizzy. i use a curlease towel, but you could also buy flour sack towels at target, etc. or a cotton tee shirt.

    don't go for a clump/curls look, accentuate the beautiful waves you have. i think wavy hair can be gorgeous!

    not familiar with all your products, you might do better with others. do you know your hair properties? with the right products you'll probably need fewer and that will keep your hair from being a "hot mess."

    3a, some 2c & 3b, medium texture, porosity normal, low elasticity :-(
    washing/cowashing, conditioning, protein tx: curl junkie products
    leave in:curl junkie conditioners and treatments as leave in
    styling: curl junkie 
    sealants - jane carter nourish & shine
  • mlleelisemlleelise Posts: 25Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Thanks, Blueblood...I do need to be more patient with the new products I'm trying.

    Rbb, first of all, your hair looks AMAZING!! Simply gorgeous! About the trim...I actually went to get a Devacut, and she didn't cut anything! I was surprised...she said my shorter layers need to grow out. However, like you, I've been thinking I need to get some of the bottom cut off, so that I will have fewer layers. Although I would HATE having shorter hair, my goal would be to grow out the top layers so that I would end up with long layers (as you suggested.)

    I noticed you use Curl Junkie products...I assume the LI conditioner is moisturizing? I REALLY appreciate your suggestions - I'll also get a different towel to use. Most of all, thank you for the encouragement to accept my hair as it is...sometimes it's hard to do.

    As a side note, my hair was totally stick straight for the first 58 years of my life. Then, all of a sudden, I started noticing ringlets in the back at the nape! One day, I got out of the pool and had to let my hair drip-dry. When I looked in a mirror, I saw the bottom layer was all in spirals! I was shocked. I still have some straighter pieces - especially on the ends of longer strands.

    I'll try some of these tips...thanks again. :-)
  • chupiechupie Posts: 5,280Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    I agree I would remove the Kinky Curly Knot Today. When I first started leave in didn't work period. Then after about 3 months I started using a little Shea Moisture smoothie (a LITTLE) as leave it. In fact, I'd try low poo, good rinse out condish and just flax seed gel. If that doesn't have enough hold you could use a little harder hold gel over it. Flour sacks are GREAT. Try less "scrunch scrunch" and longer what I call "mini-plops" where I scrunch up the hair in the towel, hold, squeezing and count to 10, then slowly let it down. Move on to the next section.
    2a medium porous, You can see my wavy tutorials here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLy8bclCLgER5N_uVYSYZNxhBHSXAW40OQ and my wavy blog is The Wavy Nation http://wavynation.wordpress.com
  • wavydazewavydaze Posts: 2,065Registered Users Curl Novice
    I think your hair looks nice on the left also.

    If you have fine hair I would recommend you get a rinse-out with protein... something like Cure Care from Sally's. I would also recommend PTs (protein treatments). I love CJ Repair Me and IAgirl's gelatin PT (DIY and cheap). CNPF from Sally's is nice as you can add it to conditioners, FSG etc.

    I second being more patient with products as well as trying only one product and one routine at a time.

    You probably don't need LI. Fine hair can often get over-conditioned so my first instinct is to tell you to try gel without LI.

    I also second trying a hard hold gel. Volumax Mega (also Sally's) is a good one.

    I would either do:

    1. 1 gel
    2. 1 foam/mousse
    3. 2 gels (fsg + hard hold gel)
    4. 1 foam + 1 gel (apply foam/mousse first)

    Don't overscrunch and experiment with your technique... look over the stickies.
    2bc/ f / ii. low porosity roots + normal-high porosity shaft where bleached. normal elasticity.

    Currently using:
    Poo: Earthbath Oatmeal & Aloe
    RO: V05 Kiwi Lime
    LI: CJ Smoothing Lotion
    Styler: UFD CM, CJ PP
    PT: CJ Repair Me

    :thumright: hydrolized protein, jelly stylers
    :angry8: guar hydroxypropyltrimonium chloride, sulfates, jojoba oil
    Neutral on cones.

    iherb discount code: CFN646
  • mlleelisemlleelise Posts: 25Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Wow! Great ideas to try...One question, Chupie and Wavydaze: if I use a stronger hold gel, I still need to get rid of the scrunchy, hard feeling right? So, is that when I should use a little of the shea moisture smoothie? After watching your video, Chupie, that's what I did today. My hair feels very soft...should I skip the SMS for now?
  • mlleelisemlleelise Posts: 25Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    PS How do I handle my dreadful cowlick? I used to tease & spray the area, but going CG, I want to get my hair healthy, so teasing is out, right? Also, should a haircut be on my 'to do' list - to get rid of some of the bottom layers? Thanks!!
  • Firefox7275Firefox7275 Posts: 3,750Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    For me clumping is all about plenty of leave in conditioner, especially one rich in fatty alcohols. In the summer hydrolysed protein helped too - stringy clumps would band together as they air dried.

    Scrunching out water with a towel easily breaks up my clumps, I plop or gently squeeze at most. I much prefer flour sack towels to microfibre.

    Kinky Curly Knot Today is not a true conditioner it is a detangler, it is not rich in the major emollients (cationic surfactants/ fatty alcohols) and is pH 7.

    What cowlick, your crown area or bangs or somewhere else?
    2a-2c, medium texture, porous/ colour treated. Three years CG. Past bra strap length heading for waist.

    CO-wash: Inecto coconut/ Elvive Volume Collagen
    Treatments: Komaza Care Matani, coconut/ sweet almond/ fractionated coconut oils, Hairveda Sitrinillah
    Leave in: Fructis Sleek & Shine (old), Gliss Ultimate Volume, various Elvive
    Styler: Umberto Giannini jelly, Au Naturale styling gelee
    Flour sack towel, pixie diffuse or air dry.
    Experimenting with: benign neglect
  • rbbrbb Posts: 4,350Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    mileelise -- thanks!

    i was going to suggest the curl junkie beauticurls leave in -- i've seen it in fine hair and it is amazing! any of the curl junkie products can be used as leave ins, it's what your hair likes. and, cj products are rich so you don't use a lot of them. cheapest place to buy them is at aveyou.com and their shipping is fast. if you want more info (discount codes, etc., let me know). i would start with the cj bc leave in as i think it works great for fine hair. she also has a strengthening conditioner that has lots of protein in it, so your hair would probably do well with that also. you could rotate them.

    it's good the stylist did not cut your hair and said the short layers have to grow. first try different products. if you do get the bottom cut, make sure it is only the bottom and most likely just get not more than 2" off, even less if you want.

    as you go on your cj journey your waves may turn into curls, happens when the hair gets healthy if that is it's natural pattern. if not, i've seen wavies whose hair i've envied! i think healthy hair is the goal.

    3a, some 2c & 3b, medium texture, porosity normal, low elasticity :-(
    washing/cowashing, conditioning, protein tx: curl junkie products
    leave in:curl junkie conditioners and treatments as leave in
    styling: curl junkie 
    sealants - jane carter nourish & shine
  • mlleelisemlleelise Posts: 25Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Firefox7275, the extreme cowlick is right at my crown (see pic 3 & 4)...any ideas?

    Rbb, thanks for the product advice. Yes, I would love any info/discount codes you might have. I'm anxious to try ANYTHING that will help.:-)
  • chupiechupie Posts: 5,280Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    mlleelise wrote: »
    Wow! Great ideas to try...One question, Chupie and Wavydaze: if I use a stronger hold gel, I still need to get rid of the scrunchy, hard feeling right? So, is that when I should use a little of the shea moisture smoothie? After watching your video, Chupie, that's what I did today. My hair feels very soft...should I skip the SMS for now?

    I find I need something like the smoothie or a butter or oil to scrunch out. But a tiny amount. Just enough to make my hands shiny.
    2a medium porous, You can see my wavy tutorials here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLy8bclCLgER5N_uVYSYZNxhBHSXAW40OQ and my wavy blog is The Wavy Nation http://wavynation.wordpress.com
  • chupiechupie Posts: 5,280Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    mlleelise wrote: »
    Firefox7275, the extreme cowlick is right at my crown (see pic 3 & 4)...any ideas?

    Rbb, thanks for the product advice. Yes, I would love any info/discount codes you might have. I'm anxious to try ANYTHING that will help.:-)

    I clip that area together while it dries.
    2a medium porous, You can see my wavy tutorials here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLy8bclCLgER5N_uVYSYZNxhBHSXAW40OQ and my wavy blog is The Wavy Nation http://wavynation.wordpress.com
  • mlleelisemlleelise Posts: 25Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Thanks, Chupie!
  • mlleelisemlleelise Posts: 25Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Okay...I've checked at target.com, and they have no product called "flour sack" anything. What are they called and where can I find them? Thanks!
  • rbbrbb Posts: 4,350Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    mlleelise wrote: »
    Okay...I've checked at target.com, and they have no product called "flour sack" anything. What are they called and where can I find them? Thanks!

    i went onto target.com and played around with words. came up with this:

    Room Essentials® Bar-Mop Kitchen Towel Set of 4 : Target

    i've never used/bought flour sack towels, just heard about them here on nc. i think they are also called bar towels. so, hopefully someone who has used them will read this. but, they are 100% cotton, so i am pretty sure they are right on.

    3a, some 2c & 3b, medium texture, porosity normal, low elasticity :-(
    washing/cowashing, conditioning, protein tx: curl junkie products
    leave in:curl junkie conditioners and treatments as leave in
    styling: curl junkie 
    sealants - jane carter nourish & shine
  • chupiechupie Posts: 5,280Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    2a medium porous, You can see my wavy tutorials here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLy8bclCLgER5N_uVYSYZNxhBHSXAW40OQ and my wavy blog is The Wavy Nation http://wavynation.wordpress.com
  • mlleelisemlleelise Posts: 25Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    I'd like to get them locally, like at Target, since an NC poster said they carry them. I'll post a new thread and see what response I get. Thanks :-)
  • chupiechupie Posts: 5,280Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    Do you have a Walmart? They definitely have then there.
    2a medium porous, You can see my wavy tutorials here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLy8bclCLgER5N_uVYSYZNxhBHSXAW40OQ and my wavy blog is The Wavy Nation http://wavynation.wordpress.com
  • TrickTrick Posts: 140Registered Users
    I get mine at Target, they are in the kitchen section with the dish towels.

    I prefer the Target ones over the Walmart ones (I have both) because they are a little larger and more square.

    2c/3a, fine, low porosity.

    Poo: Garnier Fructis Pure Clean (yes, it has A Sulfate!!, but I have Teflon hair)
    Co-wash (when I feel so inclined, which isn't often!): VO5 Kiwi Lime Clarifying Conditioner
    Conditioner/LI:
    same for both -- whatever I have in the shower at the time (I experiment a lot)
    Style: EcoStyler Olive Oil <3
    Dry: Diffuse or air dry, or both...depends on my mood

  • mlleelisemlleelise Posts: 25Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    And they are called "flour sack towels" at Walmart and Target, in-store??
    That would be GREAT if they carry them!
  • chupiechupie Posts: 5,280Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    They used to often be called tea towels and people embroidered on them.
    2a medium porous, You can see my wavy tutorials here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLy8bclCLgER5N_uVYSYZNxhBHSXAW40OQ and my wavy blog is The Wavy Nation http://wavynation.wordpress.com
  • TrickTrick Posts: 140Registered Users
    mlleelise wrote: »
    And they are called "flour sack towels" at Walmart and Target, in-store??
    That would be GREAT if they carry them!

    Yes, I believe they were both actually called flour sack towels -- I wouldn't have known what to buy otherwise, I'd never seen them before.

    They came in 4-packs at both stores, btw.

    2c/3a, fine, low porosity.

    Poo: Garnier Fructis Pure Clean (yes, it has A Sulfate!!, but I have Teflon hair)
    Co-wash (when I feel so inclined, which isn't often!): VO5 Kiwi Lime Clarifying Conditioner
    Conditioner/LI:
    same for both -- whatever I have in the shower at the time (I experiment a lot)
    Style: EcoStyler Olive Oil <3
    Dry: Diffuse or air dry, or both...depends on my mood

  • mlleelisemlleelise Posts: 25Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    I found them in-store! Yay! You can't order them. It's strange...they won't come up in a search at target.com, but if you look under Kitchen towels, they are there!
    At least I found them...thanks for all of your help! :)

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