CurlTalk

How can I enhance my curly ringlets?

I have thin hair, but it has a lot of curl. I recently got lots of layers but my hair still feels flat! Is it weighed down by product? Or is it to dry? One day I'll have bouncy Shirley temple ringlets then the next ill just have frizzled swirls!! How can I enhance my ringlets, any tips??ImageUploadedByCurlTalk1374851706.812042.jpg that is my hair on a frizzled day

Comments

  • wavydazewavydaze Posts: 2,061Registered Users
    I think your "frizzled swirls" look beautiful. What are your properties and what is your current routine?
    2bc/ f / ii. low porosity roots + normal-high porosity shaft where bleached. normal elasticity.

    Currently using:
    Poo: Earthbath Oatmeal & Aloe
    RO: V05 Kiwi Lime
    LI: CJ Smoothing Lotion
    Styler: UFD CM, CJ PP
    PT: CJ Repair Me

    :thumright: hydrolized protein, jelly stylers
    :angry8: guar hydroxypropyltrimonium chloride, sulfates, jojoba oil
    Neutral on cones.

    iherb discount code: CFN646
  • chupiechupie Posts: 5,270Registered Users Curl Neophyte
  • ManeMaidManeMaid Posts: 11Registered Users
    I shampoo every other day, rinse conditioner out with cold water, then use a wide tooth comb as soon as I get out of the shower. Then when I can't stand the dripping I blot dry upside down with a tshirt. I do this every time but the result varies so much! Then when it's half dry I add some organic Shea butter curl cream
  • ManeMaidManeMaid Posts: 11Registered Users
    This is my hair behaving, but I only get it like this once in a while and I don't know why! ImageUploadedByCurlTalk1374854623.765689.jpg
  • chupiechupie Posts: 5,270Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Hmmm. Maybe a nice flax seed gel just to calm it on non-wash but wet down days. Sealed with the butter.
  • ManeMaidManeMaid Posts: 11Registered Users
    Is that something I can get at whole foods? That's where the cream is from
  • wavydazewavydaze Posts: 2,061Registered Users
    ManeMaid wrote: »
    I shampoo every other day, rinse conditioner out with cold water, then use a wide tooth comb as soon as I get out of the shower. Then when I can't stand the dripping I blot dry upside down with a tshirt. I do this every time but the result varies so much! Then when it's half dry I add some organic Shea butter curl cream

    What products are you using?
    2bc/ f / ii. low porosity roots + normal-high porosity shaft where bleached. normal elasticity.

    Currently using:
    Poo: Earthbath Oatmeal & Aloe
    RO: V05 Kiwi Lime
    LI: CJ Smoothing Lotion
    Styler: UFD CM, CJ PP
    PT: CJ Repair Me

    :thumright: hydrolized protein, jelly stylers
    :angry8: guar hydroxypropyltrimonium chloride, sulfates, jojoba oil
    Neutral on cones.

    iherb discount code: CFN646
  • chupiechupie Posts: 5,270Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Wavy I get the impression that's all she uses. Poo condish and Shea butter.
  • chupiechupie Posts: 5,270Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    ManeMaid wrote: »
    Is that something I can get at whole foods? That's where the cream is from

    You can make it or if you don't mind mag sulfate get Jessicurl Rockin Ringlets or search Etsy for someone who makes it. It's fairly universally loved for making hair behave and very hard to "overdo". Another product people love as a first line after conditioning is CHS Curl Keeper. (Which some gals just get some KY Jelly as they are fairly solar-kid you not ). What's your weather like?
  • ManeMaidManeMaid Posts: 11Registered Users
    Oooh the curl keeper sounds nice! The weather is humid humid humid. I can't straighten my hair in the summer bc it will literally curl right back up!
  • ManeMaidManeMaid Posts: 11Registered Users
    I use Burt's bees raspberry shampoo and then redkin butter treat conditioner
  • wavydazewavydaze Posts: 2,061Registered Users
    chupie wrote: »
    Wavy I get the impression that's all she uses. Poo condish and Shea butter.

    Yes but which shampoo, which conditioner, which shea butter curl cream and what are the ingredients? Manemaid, have you figured out your hair properties and what are the dews in your city? Are you CG or interested in being CG?

    I can't really give good suggestions without knowing these details.

    My initial thoughts may be that the shea butter curl cream may be too heavy for your hair.... especially if you have thin hair. What about hair width? Fine and thin are different things.... "fine" and "coarse" refer to hair width or texture on nc.com (as in how girthy each individual hair strand is, think diameter on cross section of each hair strand) while "thin" or "thick" refers to density, so how many hair strands you have. You can be fine and thin, fine and thick, coarse and thin, coarse and thick... or in between in any combination.

    Anyway the more you tell us about your hair properties, dew points and what you've been using the better we can help you.

    Live Curly Live Free - Curly Hair Basics Good info on properties.

    NaturallyCurly's Frizz Forecast How to search for dew points in your area.
    2bc/ f / ii. low porosity roots + normal-high porosity shaft where bleached. normal elasticity.

    Currently using:
    Poo: Earthbath Oatmeal & Aloe
    RO: V05 Kiwi Lime
    LI: CJ Smoothing Lotion
    Styler: UFD CM, CJ PP
    PT: CJ Repair Me

    :thumright: hydrolized protein, jelly stylers
    :angry8: guar hydroxypropyltrimonium chloride, sulfates, jojoba oil
    Neutral on cones.

    iherb discount code: CFN646
  • ManeMaidManeMaid Posts: 11Registered Users
    Yeah I didn't know all this stuff!! good thing I'm asking. Best I can say for now is fine, thin hairs that make spirally curls? 3A i think. And I live in the south so it's always humid. Only one in the fam without dark straight hair!
  • wavydazewavydaze Posts: 2,061Registered Users
    ManeMaid wrote: »
    I use Burt's bees raspberry shampoo and then redkin butter treat conditioner

    The BB raspberry should be fine. Is it this the redken butter treat that you're using? /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.redken.com%2Fproducts%2Fhaircare%2Fsmooth-down%2Fsmooth-down-butter-treat" class="Popup It says it's discontinued. I'm having trouble finding the ingredients so can you post them? Also can you post or link the ingredients to the shea butter curl cream you're using?

    I second using jelly type products... home-made FSG, SS CEJ, JC Rocking Ringlets... they should help give your hair shape without really weighing it down. The tricky thing with these products is they don't provide the best frizz control in very high dews, but it may be enough to use alone, otherwise you may have to seal underneath with a light LI that contains anti-humectants or use just a few drops of a lighter oil like apricot or grapeseed to seal underneath before adding the jelly product. You'll have to play around here with amount. If you're low-porosity this can also be tricky... if you're high porosity, your hair can handle oils much better... see this is why it's good to know your properties!

    There's a good chance that your products are way too buttery... with the shea butter leave-in plus the "butter" rinse-out, you may have to back off one or both. If your hair is fine you'll need protein, which can spring your curls back up.

    Mag sulfate is a curl enhancer but can be drying. I don't know about the Curl Keeper, I've always wanted to try it but stayed away as it has glycerin and I don't think that would react too well to high dews.
    2bc/ f / ii. low porosity roots + normal-high porosity shaft where bleached. normal elasticity.

    Currently using:
    Poo: Earthbath Oatmeal & Aloe
    RO: V05 Kiwi Lime
    LI: CJ Smoothing Lotion
    Styler: UFD CM, CJ PP
    PT: CJ Repair Me

    :thumright: hydrolized protein, jelly stylers
    :angry8: guar hydroxypropyltrimonium chloride, sulfates, jojoba oil
    Neutral on cones.

    iherb discount code: CFN646
  • chupiechupie Posts: 5,270Registered Users Curl Neophyte
  • wavydazewavydaze Posts: 2,061Registered Users
    ManeMaid wrote: »
    Yeah I didn't know all this stuff!! good thing I'm asking. Best I can say for now is fine, thin hairs that make spirally curls? 3A i think. And I live in the south so it's always humid. Only one in the fam without dark straight hair!

    Okie... we're typing at the same time! :) If your hair is fine you should start doing protein treatments, even weekly in the humid summer. It will help spring your curls and help against frizzies too. You should also look for a rinse-out rich in protein, and you can benefit from protein in your leave-in as well.

    This is a popular and cheap protein treatment (provided you're not vegan or vegetarian) Pedaheh's Hair Blog: Science-y Hair Blog Recipes. As far as purchasable PTs I really like Spiral Solutions Protein Repair Treatment.

    Colorful Neutral Protein Filler from Sally's is also a great product to have on hand; you can add it to other products.
    2bc/ f / ii. low porosity roots + normal-high porosity shaft where bleached. normal elasticity.

    Currently using:
    Poo: Earthbath Oatmeal & Aloe
    RO: V05 Kiwi Lime
    LI: CJ Smoothing Lotion
    Styler: UFD CM, CJ PP
    PT: CJ Repair Me

    :thumright: hydrolized protein, jelly stylers
    :angry8: guar hydroxypropyltrimonium chloride, sulfates, jojoba oil
    Neutral on cones.

    iherb discount code: CFN646
  • stefflg79stefflg79 Posts: 85Registered Users
    Shea butter weighs my fine hair down, it's notorious for doing that to us fine haired ladies.

    I second PT, I also like the gelatin treatment mentioned. It can be a bit strong though, so you can always get Ion effective care at Sally's to try first to make sure your not protein sensitive. I would also make sure to follow up with a good DT. One recommended DT I also use is GVP CB (also from Sally's), but be sure to mix with something that can penetrate & moisturize the hair, like a tad bit of coconut oil & honey. You may need to follow that with a cleaning conditioner like one of the Suave Naturals or VO5 to get the Coconut oil out.

    As far as products, I really like the Yes 2 line. Right now I Lowpoo with Yes to Cukes and Rinse out with YEs 2 Carrots conditioner. I only low poo, not co wash, cowashing commonly weighs down fine hair as well.

    Lastly, I also agree with FSG. Fine hair LOVES FSG. It's really easy to make too. I usually top it with a harder holding gel like Biosilk Rock hard Gelee mixed with Herbal Essence Totally Twisted. If I get a chance when I'm not mobile, I'll link the FSG recipe. Mine changes often.

    By the way, love your ringlets!
    Fine/Thin hair (low density)
    Normal porosity
    Normal Elasticity

    Techniques: Modified Super Soaker, plopping, pixe diffusing, clipping

    Low poo: Acure, Y2Cukes
    Co Wash: SNRS, Suave Tropical Coconut
    RO: Y2C
    Style: FSG (HG!!!!), with HETT & BRHG or Devacurl Ultra light defining Gel
    PT: IAGirls Gelatin
    DT: GVP CB mixed with Coconut oil, Olive Oil, Agave (or honey).

    Favorite Styling tools: Devafuser, Deva clips & Flour Sack Towels
  • ManeMaidManeMaid Posts: 11Registered Users
    Wow I had NO IDEA they discontinued my redken butter treat!! It was amazing and I even used to scrunch my hair with it. As for the leave-Shea butter cream, it's thankfully still available ImageUploadedByCurlTalk1374863721.715223.jpg

    But for protein treatments, I've had a hairdresser mention that before but I had no idea what they were (I once did a dark beer rinse I was so desperate)
    So a protein treatment and experimenting with some jelly products would be best? And also cut down on the Shea butter, I do admit that I use a ton of that when my hair is wet bc I can't sense how much is in there
    And thank you guys SO MUCH for your help. I'm getting really excited haha :)
  • curlytwirlykatecurlytwirlykate Posts: 142Registered Users
    ManeMaid wrote: »
    Wow I had NO IDEA they discontinued my redken butter treat!! It was amazing and I even used to scrunch my hair with it. As for the leave-Shea butter cream, it's thankfully still available ImageUploadedByCurlTalk1374863721.715223.jpg

    But for protein treatments, I've had a hairdresser mention that before but I had no idea what they were (I once did a dark beer rinse I was so desperate)
    So a protein treatment and experimenting with some jelly products would be best? And also cut down on the Shea butter, I do admit that I use a ton of that when my hair is wet bc I can't sense how much is in there
    And thank you guys SO MUCH for your help. I'm getting really excited haha :)

    Ohmygosh ManeMaid! You and I are total hair twins! Your curls look a LOT like my own. It's taken awhile, but I've finally discovered how to get consistently good curls! I definitely need lots of protein, and a strong-hold gel.


    Are you interested in DIY? The most effective protein treatment for me has been a gelatine protein treatment, and it's SO easy! Here's what I do:

    1/4 tsp citric acid OR 1 tsp vinegar in 1/4 cup hot water
    Add 1 tsp gelatine and let dissolve
    Stir in 2 TBSP coconut oil
    Stir in 1/3 cup coconut milk
    Stir in 1/4 cup conditioner

    Add the following add-ins if you want to:

    Avocado (for shine)
    Egg yolk
    Essential Oils (I love rosemary!)

    I apply to wet hair, wrap it in plastic, and then co-wash it out after about an hour.

    It's FANTASTIC, and keeps the curls bouncy and reliable!

    PM me if you'd like more details on what I do... but my usual routine is in my siggy :)
    3A/2C | fine | high-po length, low-po roots | medium density | shoulder-length

    Shower Time!
    Treat: EVCO
    Co-Wash: DE Unscented Condish with added lavender and tea tree EOs
    Condish: DE Coconut Condish with added local honey

    Styling
    After Shower: Homemade FSG with added gelatine

    + bi-weekly protein DIY treatments (gelatin and egg yolk)
    + mindful nutrition
  • Morgan_AdcockMorgan_Adcock Posts: 2,573Registered Users
    I have a few thoughts about your routine.

    First off, the Burt's Bees shampoos, while technically low-poos because they don't contain sulfate detergents, have replaced those sulfate detergents with a whopping load of non-sulfate detergents, so they're only marginally better. If you mean to be CGing, I would suggest looking for something gentler.

    We don't know if you're using silicones on your hair, since the conditioner is an unknown, but the poo you're using is likely to be removing them. When you replace that, since it seems to be discontinued, it would probably be good to look for something which is volumizing. Griffin Remedy Volumizing Conditioner, Nature's Gate Volumizing Conditioner, TRESemmé Naturals Radiant Volume Conditioner, or Desert Essence Green Apple & Ginger Conditioner would be good replacements. I have superfine hair, like cobwebs, and I find the Griffin Remedy Volumizing Conditioner works particularly well for me.

    I would strongly recommend your combing your hair with the conditioner still on it, rather than rinsing first.

    I don't believe there's anything to gain from waiting until you can't stand it before towel drying your hair. If you're going to do it, save yourself the aggravation and just do it.

    I love Curl Keeper. Yes, it has glycerine, but I've had great luck with it in all dew points since I starting doing the Baptismal/sprinkle rinse. I know the Baptismal rinse seems counterintuitive with fine hair, but it works really great for me.

    I can't recommend FSG highly enough.
    Peace,
    Morgan

    Baby Fine 3B, low porosity, normal density and elasticity
    CGing since July 2008
  • wavydazewavydaze Posts: 2,061Registered Users
    stefflg79 wrote: »
    I second PT, I also like the gelatin treatment mentioned. It can be a bit strong though, so you can always get Ion effective care at Sally's to try first to make sure your not protein sensitive. I would also make sure to follow up with a good DT.

    I've tried Ion Effective Care as an RO and it kind of smothered my fine, protein-loving hair. Not nearly enough protein to be a true protein treatment, or even a good protein RO for those who need it.... however it may work as a PT for those who are coarse haired and need less protein.

    Though it does happen, it is uncommon for fine hair to be "protein sensitive." When I went to Live Curly Live Free, Tiff told me "protein, protein, protein!" on account of my fine hair.

    The first time you go for the gelatin PT, I would do the plain (and quick) version... just to get a better idea of how your hair is responding to the protein itself, and not to the other additives. If your hair springs up, then yes it likes protein and it's just a matter of figuring out how much. If it has no effect, try a stronger, longer version of the gelatin PT in a week later. If you get strawlike or "crunchy" hair after the quick, plain gelatin PT, then do a DT afterward.

    I do the plain one, comprised of one packed of Knox gelatin, 1/3 cup water, 3 drops of olive oil and a splash of vinegar. I wouldn't be able to add more oil to my PT otherwise it kind of ceases to be a PT for me. Also, you don't always need to DT after a PT. I know some people have to... I don't, I just follow with my regular RO.
    2bc/ f / ii. low porosity roots + normal-high porosity shaft where bleached. normal elasticity.

    Currently using:
    Poo: Earthbath Oatmeal & Aloe
    RO: V05 Kiwi Lime
    LI: CJ Smoothing Lotion
    Styler: UFD CM, CJ PP
    PT: CJ Repair Me

    :thumright: hydrolized protein, jelly stylers
    :angry8: guar hydroxypropyltrimonium chloride, sulfates, jojoba oil
    Neutral on cones.

    iherb discount code: CFN646
  • kathymackkathymack Posts: 9,999Registered Users
    I'll piggy back on the protein, protein and more protein. I do at least one PT a week and use a lot of products with protein.

    It may not be possible for you to get good second day hair. For some of us, it just isn't. (Of course, I'm really picky, so what might be acceptable to some, isn't for me.)

    While I put products into soaking wet hair, I start my drying process after that. Wrap hair in a Curlease (or flour sack) towel while I dress and do make up. Scrunch out water with Curls Like Us towel. Diffuse for a few minutes to set the curls. Air dry for a few hours (my hair is low porosity and takes a long time to dry.)
    3a (Corkicelli), highlighted, fine, low porosity
    SE PA

    HGs: Anything Sevi; Curly Kinks Satin Roots, Curlycue ReNew and Coil Jam; homemade FSG and okra gel; soap bars; UFD Curly Magic; Botanical Spirits Jellies, CJ Repair Me, Aloe Fix
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • ManeMaidManeMaid Posts: 11Registered Users
    Alrighty so I'm about to go to Sally's and look for a PT. I got into some chlorine this weekend and my hair is hurting.
    Also, I'm gonna try a new shampoo and conditioner.
    At Sally's should I look for the colorful neutral protein filler?
  • WavyRooWavyRoo Posts: 195Registered Users
    The neutral protein filler is definitely good to have since you have a lot of control over just how 'strong' it is based on how much you mix into you products and what products you mix it in with. I had a horrible reaction to a hardcore PT (ion Reconstructor) a while back, but my hair handles the CNPF well since I can mix it into my conditioner, only use a few drops, and because my hair does better with protein over the summer. I suggest trying the CNPF or the gelatin recipe at half strength until you know how your hair will react. You'll probably be fine with protein, but I had such a bad experience jumping right in that I suggest moderation until you're sure how your hair will react!
    2C normal/high porosity?, medium/coarse texture, lower density
    Cleanse: Pura D'Or every week or two, Yes to Cukes
    Conditioner: VO5 Kiwi Lime (LOVE!), Tresemme Naturals, YTC
    DT: GVP Conditioning Balm w/ coconut oil
    LI: a touch of JCTS
    Products: my HG is Tresemme Bouncy Curls Defining Gel mixed with a touch of BRHG over a little flax seed gel, SM Souflee/Milk for 2nd day hair, occasionally Bioterra Curling Creme and Gel
    Modified CG since November 2012- finally found what works! :)
  • stefflg79stefflg79 Posts: 85Registered Users
    Yes, Sally's has the NPF. I found it by the hair dye.
    Fine/Thin hair (low density)
    Normal porosity
    Normal Elasticity

    Techniques: Modified Super Soaker, plopping, pixe diffusing, clipping

    Low poo: Acure, Y2Cukes
    Co Wash: SNRS, Suave Tropical Coconut
    RO: Y2C
    Style: FSG (HG!!!!), with HETT & BRHG or Devacurl Ultra light defining Gel
    PT: IAGirls Gelatin
    DT: GVP CB mixed with Coconut oil, Olive Oil, Agave (or honey).

    Favorite Styling tools: Devafuser, Deva clips & Flour Sack Towels
  • ManeMaidManeMaid Posts: 11Registered Users
    So, here's a pic post gelatin homemade treatment!! :D I think it made my curls tighter if that's possible? Definitely doing it again ImageUploadedByCurlTalk1375057139.405876.jpg

    Thanks so much for the protein suggestion guys it made a world of difference after one time!
  • wavydazewavydaze Posts: 2,061Registered Users
    ManeMaid wrote: »
    So, here's a pic post gelatin homemade treatment!! :D I think it made my curls tighter if that's possible? Definitely doing it again ImageUploadedByCurlTalk1375057139.405876.jpg

    Thanks so much for the protein suggestion guys it made a world of difference after one time!

    Yup, protein makes my waves tighter too... being over-conditioned makes my waves and curls droop.

    Glad it worked out for you!
    2bc/ f / ii. low porosity roots + normal-high porosity shaft where bleached. normal elasticity.

    Currently using:
    Poo: Earthbath Oatmeal & Aloe
    RO: V05 Kiwi Lime
    LI: CJ Smoothing Lotion
    Styler: UFD CM, CJ PP
    PT: CJ Repair Me

    :thumright: hydrolized protein, jelly stylers
    :angry8: guar hydroxypropyltrimonium chloride, sulfates, jojoba oil
    Neutral on cones.

    iherb discount code: CFN646
  • chupiechupie Posts: 5,270Registered Users Curl Neophyte
  • stefflg79stefflg79 Posts: 85Registered Users
    Yay for sucess!!!!! If you make the FSG, I add the NPF to my FSG at 1/2 tsp per cup of FSG (after straining). I also add some Epsom Salts 1/4 tsp while boiling the Flaxseeds (also a curl enhancer). Other ways I am experimenting with adding protein is California Baby detangler, using as a protein spray for a boost midday and experimenting with ecostyler Krystal (gel).
    Fine/Thin hair (low density)
    Normal porosity
    Normal Elasticity

    Techniques: Modified Super Soaker, plopping, pixe diffusing, clipping

    Low poo: Acure, Y2Cukes
    Co Wash: SNRS, Suave Tropical Coconut
    RO: Y2C
    Style: FSG (HG!!!!), with HETT & BRHG or Devacurl Ultra light defining Gel
    PT: IAGirls Gelatin
    DT: GVP CB mixed with Coconut oil, Olive Oil, Agave (or honey).

    Favorite Styling tools: Devafuser, Deva clips & Flour Sack Towels
  • KorkscrewKorkscrew Posts: 1,834Registered Users
    FSG is a good place to start for a number of reasons.

    First, it doesn't contain protein, glycerin or other substances that create problems for some people. (And it's all natural.)

    Second, it's hard to actually overdo FSG applications, and seems to work well on hair that is fine or easily weighed down.

    Third, it's cost effective. It's ridiculously low-priced compared to most store-bought gels (and more moisturizing).

    Drawbacks: It's the consistency of egg whites, which can be off-putting at first. Also, it requires a little effort to make (not much though). Also, it can take a while to dry. Finally, it expires quickly unless you add preservatives.

    Whatever you do, good luck!