CurlTalk

I really need help!

WavyKimWavyKim Posts: 8Registered Users
hi everybody, I have just discovered naturallycurly.
I'm going to start off with a backstory.

I always washed my waves with a regular sulfate shampoo, and a conditioner for dry hair. My hair was always manageable. I started to grow my hair past mid - length and it started to frizz. I began using almond oil to controll the frizz. I am now a year later and my waves are pretty long. But now my hair is so dry and frizzy, I don't know what happened. I started using a sulfate free shampoo ( tigi bed head styleshots hi - def curls ) and I use a conditioner ( L'oreal elseve for curly/wavy hair ) I sometimes use tigi bed head foxy curls and I still use the almond oil. I have never used any heat.

My waves are now really dry, I can only wear it in a bun but I really liked wearing my hair down.

I tried coconut oil, egg's, shea butter, biosilk, gliss kur hair repail oil nutritive wonder serum spray (only worked on the top of my head, the rest was still very dry) and nothing worked :(

I have high porosity hair (I think), type 2b, 2c. I sleep with my hair in a bun on top of my head and I wash it every 3 days.

Can someone please help me, I don't want to cut my hair short again :(

(sorry for my english, I'm from Belgium)

Comments

  • lcl0706lcl0706 Posts: 959Registered Users
    The first thing you'll want to do is cut out the silicones, which most Tigi products are full of - a silicone is anything ending in 'cone or 'xane, except for the preservatives towards the end of the ingredient list. If you're using that and a sulfate free shampoo, you aren't ridding yourself of the silicones and they will build up on your hair and block out any moisture you're feeding it. Start with a clarifying shampoo (without silicones, one of the best and cheapest is any of the suave naturals) and toss the Tigi stuff and anything with cones.

    Find a good rinse out conditioner that is moisturizing, such as GVP conditioning balm (from Sally's) or anything richer without silicones - are you still living in Belgium? I'm not sure what the product market is over there. If you're in the US now, you should be able to find most of the products talked about around here.

    Feed it some moisture without silicones and you should see a pretty big improvement just from that. Next, you'll want to determine the rest of your hair properties, the most important one being texture. Porosity plays a big role in hair health as well. Highly porous hair is generally a result of chemical or heat damage, but since you don't straighten, it's possible you have naturally highly porous hair. There is a great link I'll post for you in helping to determine texture. Once you figure that out, you'll have more direction where to go for products. Fine hair usually prefers protein in products, especially if it's porous, and coarse hair not so much. Might help if you post a pic too!!

    Here's a link for determining the basics, and hair properties: Live Curly Live Free - Curly Hair Basics

    I couldn't find the link for the protein recipe, but it's easy to do at home, customizeable, and cheap. Jas76 posted a walk through in one of her threads, I will link it, hope she doesn't mind... http://www.naturallycurly.com/curltalk/general-discussion-about-curly-hair/157257-lazy-gelatin-pt-leads-great-hair.html

    Another good conditioner that is moisturizing and has protein is ION Effective Care. I love that stuff and can use it as a RO.

    Once you nail down properties and see how your hair responds to co-washing and/or a sulfate free shampoo, you might discover you need to clarify or use a sulfate poo (which is common among wavies with thin hair or weak waves) and you can at that point work one back in, in moderation. I use T Gel for scalp issues and it has SLES instead of SLS, which is really harsh, and the SLES doesn't bother me as long as I counteract it with a good RO. Another good cleanser that isn't as harsh as SLS is cocomidopropyl betaine. But right now it sounds like you need to focus on moisture first and foremost.

    Figure out your hair properties first, and post back here with them and if I can come up with any more advice based on that, I will certainly do so! HTH!
    :wave: fine, thin, normal/(low?) porosity. Mod-CG. Usually I can't co-wash more than 1x a week, & sometimes I have to use T-Gel in rotation due to scalp issues.

    Co-wash: VO5 Volumizing
    Poo: Giovanni 50:50
    RO:TN, Nexxus Youth Renewal, Alba Coconut
    LI: KCKT
    PT: gelatin PT, ION EC
    Stylers: Giovanni mousse, TIGI Curls Rock amplifier (a-cone), Curls Rock Strong Hold Mousse
    Gels: SCC spray gel

    hairsiggy-4-1.jpg
  • lcl0706lcl0706 Posts: 959Registered Users
    Dorm Room Curly: All in One Guide for the Curly Girl Method

    That is another really good link that explains in detail the CG method and what silicones are and how to co-wash and restore moisture.
    :wave: fine, thin, normal/(low?) porosity. Mod-CG. Usually I can't co-wash more than 1x a week, & sometimes I have to use T-Gel in rotation due to scalp issues.

    Co-wash: VO5 Volumizing
    Poo: Giovanni 50:50
    RO:TN, Nexxus Youth Renewal, Alba Coconut
    LI: KCKT
    PT: gelatin PT, ION EC
    Stylers: Giovanni mousse, TIGI Curls Rock amplifier (a-cone), Curls Rock Strong Hold Mousse
    Gels: SCC spray gel

    hairsiggy-4-1.jpg
  • WavyKimWavyKim Posts: 8Registered Users
    Thanks for your reply!

    Yes, I still live in Belgium and I don't think I'll find any of the products you talked about, but I will definitely cut out the silicones and try out some products.
    ImageUploadedByCurlTalk1367260395.121674.jpg
    Here are some pictures of my hair, it's naturally blonde. This is right after washing with the tigi shampoo and the L'oreal conditioner, with the foxy curls contour cream and almond oil applied on soaking wet hair, then I let it air dry.
  • lcl0706lcl0706 Posts: 959Registered Users
    Since you're in Belgium, you'll have to be really careful about just reading ingredients. If you can't find the products we talk about here that we know are CG, you'll have to pay attention to the ingredients in the products available to you.

    Get a good silicone free sulfate shampoo and clear out the buildup. Start feeding it moisture from there and that should fix the immediate problem. Then you can learn about product application and properties and how to choose products and fine tune those skills :-) You have really pretty hair, nice beachy waves that definitely have a lot of potential to be bombshell waves once they get properly moisturized. Your hair reminds me a LOT of mine when I first quit straightening it.

    As dorm room curly's blog mentiones, wavy hair isn't often as dry as curly hair because the oils from your scalp travel down the hair shaft easier. In the long run you might need to low-poo or clarify on a semi-regular basis but like I mentioned, get the dryness issue taken care of first :-)
    :wave: fine, thin, normal/(low?) porosity. Mod-CG. Usually I can't co-wash more than 1x a week, & sometimes I have to use T-Gel in rotation due to scalp issues.

    Co-wash: VO5 Volumizing
    Poo: Giovanni 50:50
    RO:TN, Nexxus Youth Renewal, Alba Coconut
    LI: KCKT
    PT: gelatin PT, ION EC
    Stylers: Giovanni mousse, TIGI Curls Rock amplifier (a-cone), Curls Rock Strong Hold Mousse
    Gels: SCC spray gel

    hairsiggy-4-1.jpg
  • Firefox7275Firefox7275 Posts: 3,750Registered Users
    IMO cut off any damaged or tangly parts, they will catch on the rest of your hair and damage that. You are using silicones and oils which won't really moisturise the hair just seal out any water. Agree get rid of the build up and then have all your products work towards the same goal of hydration, conditioner washing makes a huge difference to many wavy/ curly heads. Even many sulphate free shampoos are drying and stripping IMO.

    Coconut oil is wonderful for porous or damaged hair but needs to be used on naked hair, not hair that is coated in silicones. Eggs and many oils or butters contain too large a molecule to penetrate the hair.
    2a-2c, medium texture, porous/ colour treated. Three years CG. Past bra strap length heading for waist.

    CO-wash: Inecto coconut/ Elvive Volume Collagen
    Treatments: Komaza Care Matani, coconut/ sweet almond/ fractionated coconut oils, Hairveda Sitrinillah
    Leave in: Fructis Sleek & Shine (old), Gliss Ultimate Volume, various Elvive
    Styler: Umberto Giannini jelly, Au Naturale styling gelee
    Flour sack towel, pixie diffuse or air dry.
    Experimenting with: benign neglect
  • WavyKimWavyKim Posts: 8Registered Users
    Thank you for helping me!
    So I went to the store today and bought a shampoo and conditioner. I just wanted to make sure they're sulfate and silicone free so here are the ingredients.

    shampoo: aqua (water), alcohol, coco glucoside, glycerin, disodium cocoyl glutamate, sodium cocoyl glutamate, sodium PCA, gluceryl oleate, calendula officinalis flower extract, hydrolyzed silk, betaine, triticum vulgare (wheat) bran extract, xanthan gum, parfum (essential oils), limonene, linalool, citric acid, phytic acid

    conditioner: aqua/water, cetearyl alcohol, quaternium - 87, paraffinum liquidum / mineral oil, behentrimonium chloride, cetyl esters, glycerin, CI 19140 / yellow 5, CI 14700 / red 4, hydroxyethylcellulose, phenoxyethanol, argania spinosa oil / argania spinosa kernel oil, camellia oleifera seed oil, limonene, linalool, benzyl alcohol, propylene glycol, isopropyl alcohol, caprylyl glycol, geraniol, citronellol, citric acid, hexyl cinnamal, parfum / fragrance
  • lcl0706lcl0706 Posts: 959Registered Users
    they are CG, but the conditioner has mineral oil in it which is problematic for a lot of us - very difficult to remove & builds up easily. however, some here love it. just something to watch for. glycerin can also be an issue for some.

    the shampoo also has alcohol as the 2nd ingredient. is it just straight alcohol? that is odd. usually it has something in front or behind the alcohol.

    remember - you HAVE to clarify with a sulfate containing, silicone free shampoo first or you will get nowhere with this. HTH!
    :wave: fine, thin, normal/(low?) porosity. Mod-CG. Usually I can't co-wash more than 1x a week, & sometimes I have to use T-Gel in rotation due to scalp issues.

    Co-wash: VO5 Volumizing
    Poo: Giovanni 50:50
    RO:TN, Nexxus Youth Renewal, Alba Coconut
    LI: KCKT
    PT: gelatin PT, ION EC
    Stylers: Giovanni mousse, TIGI Curls Rock amplifier (a-cone), Curls Rock Strong Hold Mousse
    Gels: SCC spray gel

    hairsiggy-4-1.jpg
  • WavyKimWavyKim Posts: 8Registered Users
    To clarify, I've got the Syoss shampoo with sulfates and without silicones.
    ImageUploadedByCurlTalk1367346237.878683.jpg
  • NelekeNeleke Posts: 456Registered Users
    Hi Kim!
    I'm from Belgium as well (living in Flanders, dutchspeaking in case you ever feel like you want to pm me or so, I speak french as well)!
    There are a couple of things I really started to like...
    I really really like Ultra Doux conditioner with avocado oil and karité butter (shea), available at Kruidvat and probably a lot of other stores as well.
    Something else I really love: Yes to Cucumbers (made in...USA), available at Essenza.
    And my sulfate free shampoo that is helping me to battle dry hair: Rainforest Radiance shampoo from the Bodyshop.
    As a mousse I use Taft mousse for curls (a pink bottle) available at Kruidvat or sometimes I use a Fructis gel with bamboo extract (again: Kruidvat).

    I had a really rough time with dry hair 2 weeks ago, but it's getting better again...(better since I started using the radiance shampoo once or twice a week)

    I am sooo happy to see another Belgian curly on NC ^^ (although I already know one:p)
    2c: fine texture, normal porosity, normal elasticity, normal-high density
    CG since March 8th 2013
    Low Poo: Rainforest Radiance shampoo
    Conditioner: Yes to Cucumbers
    Styler: BRHG, Garnier Fructis Gel
    PT: Gliss Kur Repair & Volume

    iherb.com: get a 5$ discount on orders under 40$ or a 10$ discount on orders over 40$ when you order for your first order by using the following discount code: CFH441
  • WavyKimWavyKim Posts: 8Registered Users
    Hi Neleke

    Thank you so much, I'm really glad to have found someone from Belgium who can help me out.

    I'll definitely try out some of the products you mentioned. My hair just can't get any worse at this point :p
  • NelekeNeleke Posts: 456Registered Users
    My absolute favourite is the Ultra doux avocado oil-karité butter conditioner... when I put it on in the shower, I immediately feel my hair getting less dry... it's woooonderful... (although I still have dry hair, but it's already better), so start experimenting with that one..
    2c: fine texture, normal porosity, normal elasticity, normal-high density
    CG since March 8th 2013
    Low Poo: Rainforest Radiance shampoo
    Conditioner: Yes to Cucumbers
    Styler: BRHG, Garnier Fructis Gel
    PT: Gliss Kur Repair & Volume

    iherb.com: get a 5$ discount on orders under 40$ or a 10$ discount on orders over 40$ when you order for your first order by using the following discount code: CFH441
  • lcl0706lcl0706 Posts: 959Registered Users
    Glad you found someone to help you who is from the area! the sulfate shampoo you got looks like it'll do the trick!

    don't be afraid to experiment with different products :-) a lot of this journey is trial & error.
    :wave: fine, thin, normal/(low?) porosity. Mod-CG. Usually I can't co-wash more than 1x a week, & sometimes I have to use T-Gel in rotation due to scalp issues.

    Co-wash: VO5 Volumizing
    Poo: Giovanni 50:50
    RO:TN, Nexxus Youth Renewal, Alba Coconut
    LI: KCKT
    PT: gelatin PT, ION EC
    Stylers: Giovanni mousse, TIGI Curls Rock amplifier (a-cone), Curls Rock Strong Hold Mousse
    Gels: SCC spray gel

    hairsiggy-4-1.jpg
  • jakrussel3jakrussel3 Posts: 423Registered Users
    One other thing you might consider doing is stop using the shampoo on the length of your hair. Instead, just put some on your fingertips and use it to scrub/massage your scalp clean instead. Then use the conditioner on your hair. If you've cut out silicones, you shouldn't have any problems doing this.

    Also, you might not want to do a protein treatment. They can be very drying and if your hair is already dry, it could cause problems.

    Good luck!
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Hair Properties: 2A/2B, Medium-fine, Normal porosity, Normal elasticity, Medium density
    Low Poo: DevaCare, Yes to Cuc's
    Rinse Out: DevaCare One Condition, Yes to Cuc's
    Cowash: Suave Naturals Lavender, Yes to Carrots Scalp Conditioner
    Curl Cream: AG ReCoil, Organix Moroccan Oil Curl Cream
    Gel/Mousse: Sweet Curls Elixirs FSG w/ Mag Sulfate added, Sweet Curls Elixirs hard hold gel, DevaCurl Frizz Free Foam, Aquage Uplifting Foam
    Protein: Spiral Solutions Protein Spray for daily use
  • tambalinatambalina Posts: 64Registered Users
    There is a technique I've learned on the Long Hair boards called CWC (Condition, wash, condition).

    There are three steps:

    1.) Condition (with regular rinse out conditioner) hair from ear length all the way down to ends. Do not rinse!

    2.) Wash (with cowash, lowpoo or shampoo) just the scalp, making sure to really scrub your scalp with the pads of your fingertips. If you are using a lathering product, work it up into a rich lather before applying to the scalp. RINSE.

    3.) Condition again by re-applying your regular rinse out conditioner and leaving it on for at least three minutes or for the duration of your shower. Rinse well.

    When my hair was tailbone length, this was the way I washed my hair every three days. Had very healthy and shiny hair. I agree that you shouldn't do a protein treatment until your hair is moisturized properly.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    CG Journey Start Date: 08.21.12 Now modified CG
    F/M texture, Med Density, Low/Normal Porosity, Hennindigo
    Current Routine (Still working out the kinks):
    Sulfate wash: CHSTS
    Low-Poo: OMAO
    CO-Wash: IEC, VO5VMT, TNRV
    Rinse Out: YTCarrots, DLOO, Renpure Red, GVPCB
    LI: YTCarrots, CCC
    PT: NPF
    Styler: AG:RC, KCCC, LALNC, FSG
    Gel: BRHG+Biotera
  • WavyKimWavyKim Posts: 8Registered Users
    Wow, so I tried this CWC with the products i mentioned before. My hair looks way better, but I'm not there yet :D
    Here are some pictures
    ImageUploadedByCurlTalk1367754860.700547.jpg ImageUploadedByCurlTalk1367754870.988708.jpg

    THANK YOU!! :D
  • PomegranateCurlPomegranateCurl Posts: 212Registered Users
    remember that if you're having trouble finding CG products in the netherlands you can also order online. iherb.com has quite a few CG options... shampoos, conditioners, gels, stylers etc. I got a delivery from them recently in Asia and it arrived in a timely manner. Prices were not bad for the products. I would highly recommend Iherb. I also have a discount code... I have to check for it if you're interested.
  • GusteGuste Posts: 7Registered Users
    .