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From Dear Abby - Sound Off!

MephistoMephisto Posts: 555Registered Users
DEAR ABBY: I am 23 and live at home with my parents. My boyfriend is 24, and also lives at home.

His mother has given him a cruise for his birthday, and he would like to take me. However, my parents don't believe in premarital sex and have already told me I cannot go away with him -- that only as a married couple can we travel together alone.

I do not want to miss this trip. I would love to spend this kind of time with my boyfriend. I love him very much, but my parents limit our time together. Is there a way to get around this?
-- RESTRICTED IN OCEANSIDE, N.Y.

DEAR RESTRICTED: Yes. Invite a chaperone or get married.
The good people do is interred with their bones. Their mistakes live on forever...
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Comments

  • MephistoMephisto Posts: 555Registered Users
    This one struck me as I read it in the paper on Monday. :D

    This chick is TWENTY-THREE YEARS OLD. She has the opportunity to go on a cruise. And she's letting her parents dictate whether or not she can go on a vacation?

    This isn't a case of "you live in my house, you live by my rules." She's not asking permission to have the boyfriend sleep over.

    Dear Abby screwed this one up. She doesn't need a chaperone and she doesn't need to get married. She probably needs to move out of her parents home, but if I'm in the same situation... I take the cruise despite my parents objections. They need to have faith in the daughter that she isn't going to be a focking machine on the vacation. And if she is... it's not her parents business at 23!

    Thoughts?
    The good people do is interred with their bones. Their mistakes live on forever...
  • slinky1slinky1 Banned Posts: 1,612Banned Users
    I acutally saw this. They must be Baptist or something.

    My parents are even more confusing. Pre-marital sex is okay, going on trips w/bf is okay, living with guys you aren't "involved" with is okay, but somehow, living with bf is not okay. Well, actually its not that confusing, just stupid.
    ;)
  • Little Miss Snarky BooyahLittle Miss Snarky Booyah Posts: 452Registered Users
    I completely agree with you. No matter what my views are on premarital sex, you can't force them on other people! Maybe if she was 16 or something. But not at 23!


    Abby shouldn't have made her response so cut and dried. She should have said something about maybe looking into another living situation. I don't know, I just don't agree with Abby here.
    You are an evil biatch, evil. Your life must suck!

    /home/leaving?target=http%3A%2F%2Fbooyahlicious.blogspot.com%2F" class="Popup
  • curlyrollercurlyroller Posts: 12Registered Users
    Mephisto wrote:
    This isn't a case of "you live in my house, you live by my rules."

    actually, i was thinking that just MIGHT be the case. sure, she's 23, but if she's accepting her parents help by living with them, it's only natural to assume there might be conditions. if she doesn't like the conditions, she should get her own apartment and be done with it.

    but, i also wonder if what abby is saying is: you can't change your parents mind on this one, so here's the way to appease them and go on the trip.
    doh! little miss cleeky booyah hit me! snowball.gif

    hair type: 3b with some 3a

    "But to you who fear My name The Sun of Righteousness shall arise With healing in His wings..." Malachi 4:2a
  • mrspoppersmrspoppers Posts: 7,223Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    I think she should move out.
    When are women going to face the fact that they don’t know their own bodies as well as men who have heard things?

    Don Langrick
    Bonsai Culturist
  • naturaltnaturalt Posts: 175Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    You live in your parents house, you live by your parents rules. It sucks, but that's the way it is.
    cloud9.gif
  • slinky1slinky1 Banned Posts: 1,612Banned Users
    naturalt wrote:
    You live in your parents house, you live by your parents rules. It sucks, but that's the way it is.

    As if the parents weren't living in their own parents' houses back when they were dating and having premarital sex.
    ;)
  • ChiChiChiChi Posts: 20Registered Users

    but, i also wonder if what abby is saying is: you can't change your parents mind on this one, so here's the way to appease them and go on the trip.

    That's what it sounds like to me. This woman's parents sound really, really domineering. However, if she doesn't want to deal with their rules (or go on this trip without them getting totally po'd at her), it's pretty obvious what her options are.
  • naturaltnaturalt Posts: 175Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    slinky1 wrote:
    naturalt wrote:
    You live in your parents house, you live by your parents rules. It sucks, but that's the way it is.

    As if the parents weren't living in their own parents' houses back when they were dating and having premarital sex.

    #1 we don't know that.
    #2 we don't know their parents' rules.
    #3 that is irrelevant to this situation.

    Bottom line is, if she wants to be more independent she needs to move out and live her own life. She can't have it both ways.
    cloud9.gif
  • MephistoMephisto Posts: 555Registered Users
    actually, i was thinking that just MIGHT be the case. sure, she's 23, but if she's accepting her parents help by living with them, it's only natural to assume there might be conditions. if she doesn't like the conditions, she should get her own apartment and be done with it.

    Which is why I add "she probably should move out."

    However, "my house, my rules" should NEVER mean that you have to live the entirety of your life by the parents rules... absolutely NOT.

    - Don't come home after 11. Okay.
    - Don't come home drunk. Okay.
    - No BF sleepovers. Okay.
    - No unannounced guests. Okay.
    - Mow the lawn. Great.
    - Take out the trash. Super.
    - Do the dishes. Okay.
    - Make your bed when you get up in the morning. I can handle.

    But "you can't take a vacation?" Get outta dodge. Not in this lifetime. What's next? You can't eat at a certain restaurant? Work at a particular job? Drive a certain car? Hang out with certain friends?

    Okay... I'll go on the vacation, and I promise not to have pre-marital sex. HOUSE rules don't extend beyond the HOUSE. And they CERTAINLY should not for someone who is 23-years old.

    Parents Options:

    1) Trust their daughter.
    2) Alienate their daughter, have her move out, go on the same vacation and have the same premarital sex.

    :roll:
    The good people do is interred with their bones. Their mistakes live on forever...
  • curlyrollercurlyroller Posts: 12Registered Users
    Mephisto wrote:
    [HOUSE rules don't extend beyond the HOUSE. And they CERTAINLY should not for someone who is 23-years old.

    i don't think that's always necessarily the case. for example, what if they had a house rule of: don't do drugs. extreme example, but that's one where it certainly could acceptably extend beyond the borders of the property line.

    if that's how you want to raise your kids, great, but i sure plan on having rules for mine that extend past the property line. especially while they are under 18. and i don't think that's blanket crazy.

    again, the simple answer keeps coming back to: if she doesn't like it, no one's stopping her (we assume) from moving out where she can be rule free.
    doh! little miss cleeky booyah hit me! snowball.gif

    hair type: 3b with some 3a

    "But to you who fear My name The Sun of Righteousness shall arise With healing in His wings..." Malachi 4:2a
  • CGNYCCGNYC Posts: 4,938Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    It doesn't matter weather her parents are right or wrong. If she lives there, she can either live by their rules and keep the peace or break their rules and deal with the consequences. Those are the choices.

    This is why grown people don't need to be living at home.
  • naturaltnaturalt Posts: 175Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Mephisto wrote:
    actually, i was thinking that just MIGHT be the case. sure, she's 23, but if she's accepting her parents help by living with them, it's only natural to assume there might be conditions. if she doesn't like the conditions, she should get her own apartment and be done with it.

    Which is why I add "she probably should move out."

    However, "my house, my rules" should NEVER mean that you have to live the entirety of your life by the parents rules... absolutely NOT.

    - Don't come home after 11. Okay.
    - Don't come home drunk. Okay.
    - No BF sleepovers. Okay.
    - No unannounced guests. Okay.
    - Mow the lawn. Great.
    - Take out the trash. Super.
    - Do the dishes. Okay.
    - Make your bed when you get up in the morning. I can handle.

    But "you can't take a vacation?" Get outta dodge. Not in this lifetime. What's next? You can't eat at a certain restaurant? Work at a particular job? Drive a certain car? Hang out with certain friends?

    Okay... I'll go on the vacation, and I promise not to have pre-marital sex. HOUSE rules don't extend beyond the HOUSE. And they CERTAINLY should not for someone who is 23-years old.

    Parents Options:

    1) Trust their daughter.
    2) Alienate their daughter, have her move out, go on the same vacation and have the same premarital sex.

    :roll:

    The "don't come home after 11" rule would apply here, preventing her from going on the vacation ;).

    But seriously, I think that the rule is dumb and *I* would not follow it. I'd move out first. But this girl is still living under her parents' roof and she knows how strict they are...what did she expect Abby to say? I do think that Abby could have given her a longer answer, but I don't necessarily think she was dead wrong. If you had an option in this poll of "she's mostly making sense" or "I mostly agree with her" I would have voted for that.
    cloud9.gif
  • CGNYCCGNYC Posts: 4,938Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    You can't choose to be a an adult only when it's easy and convenient. You want to be an adult and go on vacation with your boy friend, you need to be an adult and not live with your parents.
  • slinky1slinky1 Banned Posts: 1,612Banned Users

    This is why grown people don't need to be living at home.

    Bottom line.

    But, we could also assume that this girl can not afford to move out on her own, and has no one else but her bf to room with. In this case, she might be staying home to appease her parents and not move in with her bf. Even if this is true, it is a flimsy excuse for living home at 24.
    ;)
  • StephSStephS Posts: 352Registered Users
    You can't choose to be a an adult only when it's easy and convenient. You want to be an adult and go on vacation with your boy friend, you need to be an adult and not live with your parents.

    Absolutely.
  • Aya9877Aya9877 Posts: 97Registered Users
    My initial reaction was Oh for crying out loud is she off her rocker?

    But upon thinking about it further, I would say that while her advice sucks, I agree with what I believe her message to be. This girl is choosing to live with her parents. As was stated earlier, if she doesnt want to abide by the rules, she can move out. Many parents instill similar rules on thier kids within the bounds of their homes. I know a couple that has lived together for 20+ years, but since they are not married, the womans parents do not allow them to sleep in the same room when they visit. Parents can be weird like that.

    By inviting a chaperone, it gives the parents a false sense of security that nothing will/can happen. Ignorance is bliss in many cases. Abby didn't say the chaperone had to share a room, or anything like that. Invite a 3rd person to please the parents. Simple enough. If she doesnt like it, then grow up and move out. I think Abby was simply offering ways around the situation that would please the parents. The girl is not looking to start WWIII, and by blatantly going against her parents wishes, that is what she would be doing. Abby simply gave the two options that the parents might accept.
    GuardianB wrote:
    I am perfect.
    - February 25, 2004

    Aya. That's Aya spelled backwards.

    Barack Obama for President in 2008!
  • NetGNetG Posts: 8,116Registered Users
    You can't choose to be a an adult only when it's easy and convenient. You want to be an adult and go on vacation with your boy friend, you need to be an adult and not live with your parents.

    I sort of disagree with you. I do think that, if she wants to live by her own rules, she needs to move out. Period. I think that agrees with your points.

    However, I think living with her parents doesn't necessarily mean not being an adult. As a member of the "I lived with my mom to help her pay bills after the divorce" club, I know that at times living with a parent can be a more grown up thing to do, even if it can stink. That said, while living with my mom I was also saving money and bought my own house so I could move out.

    I voted that Abby's right. Because, as naturalT said, there wasn't a "sort of" option. Saying something to the effect of what CurlyGurly said above would have been a better answer, I think.
    The pews never miss a sermon but that doesn't get them one step closer to Heaven.
    -Speckla

    But at least the pews never attend yoga!
  • jenNchijenNchi Posts: 10Registered Users
    I'm confused here. On the one hand, I'm completely behind following your parents's rules when you live at home.

    However... if she (I assume it's a she) can't afford to leave home, how is she going to pay to go on this cruise? I realize a cruise would be a one time expense as opposed to paying rent every month, but the young woman describes it as a larger issue. She says her parents limit the amount of time she spends with her boyfriend.

    If that's the case, then this young woman has already ceded a great deal of control to her parents. She's either going to have to accept their rules or get her own place.

    Abby's advice is right on. The young woman has accepted this degree of parental control, and she'll have to work within her parents's rules. If she likes the boyfriend more, then she should start making other living arrangements.
  • Jenny CJenny C Posts: 1,195Registered Users
    My father was very strict and uptight when it came to sex and I was never allowed to go on vacation with a boyfriend. I would just lie and say other people were going on the vacation with us, because everyone knows you can't have sex if other people will be there :roll: . For some reason this made it okay and my father could handle it. I'm 33 and have been on my own for almost 10 years and I STILL lie to my father when I go on vacation with boyfriends. Logically I know it's stupid and I can do whatever I want, but it's just easier to let him live in denial. Probably not the best way to handle such a situation, but it's the easiest.

    I can't imagine that Dear Abby would tell this girl to lie, so I guess I agree with her advice assuming the girl wants to continue living with her parents.
    If you got nothing to bring to the table - don't even bother sitting down.
  • Aya9877Aya9877 Posts: 97Registered Users
    JenNChi,

    The boyfriends mother is sending him on a cruise as a gift, and I believe the implication is that he can take someone along. So its not an expense for her

    JennyC,

    I believe that for most parents ignorance is bliss. Simple enough. By telling your dad that other people were going with you, it allowed him to believe that nothing would happen. Often times parents believe what they want to believe.
    GuardianB wrote:
    I am perfect.
    - February 25, 2004

    Aya. That's Aya spelled backwards.

    Barack Obama for President in 2008!
  • MephistoMephisto Posts: 555Registered Users
    It was a matter of principle with my parents. Whenever a situation arose with a girlfriend that would see her sleep-over... a vacation... a late-night out... either I or she slept on the couch or in another available room.

    Not doing drugs... I understand and wasn't giving a "strict" interpretation of not extending beyond the property lines.

    However, there are house rules and then there is trying to control someone's life. I flat-out disagree that living with your parents entitles them to make rules to govern every aspect of your life, including who you would take a vacation with.

    Not only is it disrespectful to the daughter, it clearly demonstrates a lack of trust.

    Is that what rules are supposed to do?

    I don't disagree that she should move out. However, under her circumstances, I would flat-out tell them to either kick me out, or I will make appropriate arrangements to move out, but under NO circumstances would they EVER get away with a rule (at 23YO) that would preclude my taking a vacation. NEVER.

    She lives at home. She isn't under house arrest.

    She can have sex in a car. Sex over his house. Sex in a motel. Sex at work. She can have sex with her boyfriend anytime and anywhere she wants. So she should not take a vacation to appease her parents contention that her not going means they won't have sex? What if they have no intention of having sex until marriage?

    This isn't about being a "house rule" it's about being a control freak, no question in my mind.

    I might add... I am totally STUNNED at how close the vote is. I didn't post this with that expectation.
    The good people do is interred with their bones. Their mistakes live on forever...
  • naturaltnaturalt Posts: 175Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Meph, are we discussing the insanity of the rule or the advice Abby gave?
    cloud9.gif
  • curlyrollercurlyroller Posts: 12Registered Users
    naturalt wrote:
    Meph, are we discussing the insanity of the rule or the advice Abby gave?

    i think it morphed. possibly my fault. ;) well, mine and meph's. :D

    re: the insanity of the rule: i think that the determination of insanity on this one is really going to depend on your individual beliefs, etc. obviously, this is an important issue to the parents. it's not like they are giving her a bedtime [ my parents tried to give me a bedtime when i came home from college. the bedtime was earlier than my curfew. i.e. if i was going out, i could be out until midnight, but if i was home, they wanted me in bed at 9pm. now THAT was insane. ;) ]

    i don't think this rule is necessarily a crazy one.
    doh! little miss cleeky booyah hit me! snowball.gif

    hair type: 3b with some 3a

    "But to you who fear My name The Sun of Righteousness shall arise With healing in His wings..." Malachi 4:2a
  • MephistoMephisto Posts: 555Registered Users
    Both.

    I believe that Dear Abby should have advised her to take the vacation and move out. Not "get married" or "bring a chaperone" (which in my mind = decline the vacation).

    I think people are VOTING based upon the sanity or insanity of the rule.

    I voted that Abby gave the wrong advice... and *I* was discussing why I feel that she should absolutely stand up for herself and take the vacation.
    The good people do is interred with their bones. Their mistakes live on forever...
  • SCSC Posts: 15Registered Users
    I agree with Mephisto- the woman is 23 yrs old , a consenting adult.
    As far as going by the house rules, fine, but she has the right as an adult to go out of town with whomever she wants.

    I also agree that her parents are controlling, and Abbey was wrong.
    SC
    2/3a/3b
  • kurlykittykurlykitty Posts: 162Registered Users
    I think Abby's advice missed the point - she approached her response as giving/denying permission, while missing the larger issue of balancing personal freedom and living up to the rules/expectations of those whose roof you live under.

    My response, had I been Abby, would have been, "The rule may seem unreasonable, but, you live in their home. They have the right to impose rules in exchange for allowing you to live there. If this rule is unacceptable to you, you always have the option of moving out. At 23, I suggest you look into it."

    About the rule itself - I find it unreasonable, but then again I disagree with its basic premise.

    If we - for some reason - had 18+ offspring living with us, our "rules" for them would be more along the lines of the rules you'd have with an adult housemate than a minor child. Stuff like rent or comparable agreements and the basic courtesy rules that make sharing a home with other adults without killing them possible. Not curfews and rules about their sex lives.

    Honestly, with an adult child living at home, my only sex rules would be to keep it private, quiet, and with legally consenting partners.
    "Beware the man of one book." --Latin proverb
  • JosephineJosephine Posts: 14,177Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    Coming from a conservative family, I don't think her parent's rule is insane in any way, especially if there morals dont include premarital sex. I would never even dare ask my parents to go stay with a boy at any age. As someone mentioned earlier, even if I'm out of the house and 30 years old, I still wouldnt tell them. It's just respect.

    As for abby's advice, I don't know. There are oother options that don't include giving in to your parents standards. She must be an old fashioned lady.
  • kurlykittykurlykitty Posts: 162Registered Users
    She must be an old fashioned lady.

    Not so sure about that.

    On the same day Abby told the 23 year old to "get a chaperone or get married," she also chastised a mother who tossed out her 19-year-old son's sex toys because it was a violation of his privacy and if she really thought her son and his gf weren't having sex or at least sexually intimate play, she should get her head out of orbit, return to earth, and be sure to talk to them about contraception. That's not exactly "old-fashioned" advice.

    In any case, seeing the two letters side by side is an odd experience in cognitive dissonance.
    "Beware the man of one book." --Latin proverb
  • DiscgirlDiscgirl Posts: 746Registered Users
    The fact she's asking Dear Abby to tell her "how to get around it" makes me think she probably needs her parents to tell her what to do. If she's a grown woman and wants to act like an adult, she should stop acting as if she's trying to get her parents to extend her curfew or trying to figure out how to get around it. She needs to either 1) get off the gravy train and move out , 2) tell her parents she's an adult, do what she wants to do and accept whatever consequences flow from that or 3) suck it up and let them control her life.
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