CurlTalk

What you want to tell your stylist.....

I am a stylist who has been trying to learn everything curly for quite awhile now. I have reciently been trained by Deva in dry cutting and have been seeing wonderful results. I read up here at N.C. every morning and I know there are some who still fear or hate getting their hair cut.
I'd like to know, what you want your stylist to know.
What do you want most from your experence?
Tell me how you talk to your stylist, what you ask for, and I'll try to give you language that they will understand, so you can both be on the same page. I believe that a great haircut starts with great communication.

I will continue to try to learn from you, and hope to help a little with bridging the communication gap.
3a/3b coarse and thick.....big and red

Advanced Deva inspired Stylist

Comments

  • Lucky CharmLucky Charm Posts: 1,250Registered Users
    Struttswife had a great thread a while ago about a related topic - lots of fantastic information that many of us rely on. http://www.naturallycurly.com/curltalk/salon-stylist-chatter/76806-what-should-i-tell-my-stylist.html

    And on behalf of curls everywhere, thank you for taking the time and effort to learn ow to treat our curls the way they deserve to be treated :)
    - 2C - Coarse Canopy & med/fine underlayers
    - MOP C Hydrating 'poo
    - LOreal Natures Therapy Moisturizing condish, ION Effective Care, Garnier S&S (old formula)
    - treatments: CJ Curl Rehab, CJ Repair Me!
    - plopping, diffusing, and clipping the roots
  • bigredapmibigredapmi Posts: 229Registered Users
    Yes, I was a part of that conversation in the beginning. I've since worked and learned even more, and was hoping to keep it going. There are alot of newbes and unanswered questions about cutting curly hair.
    I thought a spin on that thread, What do you want your stylist to know, would help me know what curlies want from a stylist, and help you learn how to talk to your stylist.
    3a/3b coarse and thick.....big and red

    Advanced Deva inspired Stylist
  • Auntie BubbsAuntie Bubbs Posts: 1,068Registered Users
    Well, alot of us tell the stylist exactly what we want, and don't get what we've asked for. Why is that?
    For me, that's the main reason I put off going to the hair salon. Fear that I'm going to get the opposite of what I want, or rather, fear that I'm going to tell the stylist "X is what I want" and when she's done, it's not going to a) look like what I said, and b) it's going to look really awful.
    That's me with FSG as my styler!!

    3b. fine & thick, coarse, dry, medium porosity. Sucks up product and loves ACVs! FSG is my HG!

    Currently using:
    Low Poo: TJ's Refresh No Poo: CoWash w/VO-5; Sonoma Soap Company sulfate-free poo
    RO: Yes to Cuc; SSC Lavender Condish; Sally GVP LI: Donna Marie Miracle D&C
    Style: FSG w/Aussie Instant Freeze & CIAB
  • jaclyn15jaclyn15 Posts: 227Registered Users
    I agree with auntie bubbs! My stylists have always taken more length than I want off no matter how adamant I am.

    I think managing expectations is important too. When I had my deva cut it was so awful and uneven. I wish she had warned me that unevenness could occur
    My hair: 3b, corkicelli, medium porosity, medium texture, medium/thick density

    Co-wash: DevaCurl NoPoo
    Rinse-out: GVP Conditioning Balm
    Leave-in: KCKT, Suave Naturals Coconut, or my rinse-out!
    Gel: SS FHG (my new HG!!)... I also like HESMU, AIF, CJ CQ, BRHG, CJ PP and the occasional LALSG

    Likes: Plopping!
    Dislikes: Glycerin

    CG and loving it! :hello1:
  • bigredapmibigredapmi Posts: 229Registered Users
    Well, alot of us tell the stylist exactly what we want, and don't get what we've asked for. Why is that?
    For me, that's the main reason I put off going to the hair salon. Fear that I'm going to get the opposite of what I want, or rather, fear that I'm going to tell the stylist "X is what I want" and when she's done, it's not going to a) look like what I said, and b) it's going to look really awful.


    Well, alot of us tell the stylist exactly what we want, and don't get what we've asked for. Why is that?

    This is exactly why I started this thread. I sometimes think it is a communication barrier between client and hairdresser. I want to give you "our" language.
    The conversation should go " this is what I want" from you. My reply should be " this is what I hear you want"
    If we should both agree, I can then tell you " this is what I can do and how I can do it" Again, until we agree.
    This conversation must happen! We must both be comfortable with going forward. If you are not, you must leave.

    fear that I'm going to tell the stylist "X is what I want" and when she's done, it's not going to a) look like what I said.
    This is communication, what you "want" vs. how it "looks" If you are telling me how to cut your hair, I need to tell you what the result will be, how it will look.
    Let's talk Length, shape, style. In detail. We must come to an agreement before I pick up my scissors.
    3a/3b coarse and thick.....big and red

    Advanced Deva inspired Stylist
  • bigredapmibigredapmi Posts: 229Registered Users
    jaclyn15 wrote: »
    I agree with auntie bubbs! My stylists have always taken more length than I want off no matter how adamant I am.


    My stylists have always taken more length than I want off no matter how adamant I am.
    O.K. If you sit in my chair and tell me this, I Am Not going to cut your length, At All. I'm a curly, I get it.
    Please don't be mad at me, I need to build trust first.


    I think managing expectations is important too. When I had my deva cut it was so awful and uneven. I wish she had warned me that unevenness could occur

    Deva cuts. Expectations. Uneveness. Ugh.
    Do you like your wet haircut? Is it even? if so stick with it. Your great!
    Deva cuts are not uneven!! They are cut perfectly even, dry, on curls. 3-d haircutting. Does that make sense? See differently? I cut straight hair straight, 1-d, I cut curly hair, curly, 3-d.
    Let's put it this way. I'm a highly trained hairdresser, I cut my hair wet, perfectly even. When it dried I had this clump of curls that was cut to go in the back, but would dry to the front. Every time, even if I straighten it, backcomb it, with hairspray, whoop! in the front. Bleh. Looked uneven, Cut even, looked uneven.
    Dry Deva cuts, :toothy5: I can now cut my curls where they live!!! Where they dry!!! Everytime!!! and it now blends dry, perfectly even!!!!
    A new option that I never had before, that opens up all kind of oppurtunitys. So, Excited :blob5:

    Does that explaine it better? Does that help you understand your options? Does it help you make a better decission? I hope so. I really hope this helps.
    3a/3b coarse and thick.....big and red

    Advanced Deva inspired Stylist
  • jaclyn15jaclyn15 Posts: 227Registered Users
    bigredapmi - thanks for your response about DevaCut. I guess my question is, how can you count on your hair falling in the same way each day? The day I had my DevaCut, my curls were cut for the way my hair was laying on that particular day. But the problem is, my curls have a mind of their own! Every day is a little different. So in my case the unevenness became noticeable even though I was wearing my hair technically the same way (same products, methods etc.)

    Also, I BARELY EVER straighten my hair (once every 4-6 months?)... but I want to know that when I do, I won't look like my hair is uneven.

    I am not particularly thrilled with my wet cuts either. It is possible that the Deva stylist I went to was just bad, and that someone else may do a better job. I haven't had a cut in 7 mos. because I don't know where to go from here!
    My hair: 3b, corkicelli, medium porosity, medium texture, medium/thick density

    Co-wash: DevaCurl NoPoo
    Rinse-out: GVP Conditioning Balm
    Leave-in: KCKT, Suave Naturals Coconut, or my rinse-out!
    Gel: SS FHG (my new HG!!)... I also like HESMU, AIF, CJ CQ, BRHG, CJ PP and the occasional LALSG

    Likes: Plopping!
    Dislikes: Glycerin

    CG and loving it! :hello1:
  • GreencurlsGreencurls Posts: 81Registered Users
    I am a bit confused about the different "elevations" when cutting layers.

    A while back I asked my stylist for layers, and she held my hair up straight above my head and cut--something I had never seen before in my life! The results weren't very good. Not sure I can explain.

    Later on, I asked for a different style with slightly stacked layers all over. (Is this a good style for curlies?) She held my hair out at 90 degrees, I think, and that ended up with a cut that looked much better.

    Then I read here that we should be asking for a 45 degree elevation for layers, and nothing higher than that.

    So, I am confused. Can you explain the elevation thing and how it works, and how it makes a difference in how the layering turns out? Thanks!
  • bigredapmibigredapmi Posts: 229Registered Users
    jaclyn15 wrote: »
    bigredapmi - thanks for your response about DevaCut. I guess my question is, how can you count on your hair falling in the same way each day? The day I had my DevaCut, my curls were cut for the way my hair was laying on that particular day. But the problem is, my curls have a mind of their own! Every day is a little different. So in my case the unevenness became noticeable even though I was wearing my hair technically the same way (same products, methods etc.)

    Also, I BARELY EVER straighten my hair (once every 4-6 months?)... but I want to know that when I do, I won't look like my hair is uneven.

    I am not particularly thrilled with my wet cuts either. It is possible that the Deva stylist I went to was just bad, and that someone else may do a better job. I haven't had a cut in 7 mos. because I don't know where to go from here!

    Jaclyn, I'm sorry, I've just found this. Cutting the curl where it lives.... a common misconception is that we are looking at the ends when we choose to cut the curl. In reality I am looking at the scalp, where the curl forms and then to where it falls into the next curl. So your hair is even, does fall the same way, everyday, naturally, without manipulation. When curls are cut in clumps, they find eachother again, I call it Playing nice. I can tell you that I loved my first deva cut, but every deva cut since has just gotten better! Curly hair and being c.g. is a journey. Talk to your stylist and tell her your concerns and any wonkie places and she will be able to learn you curls with you, tweek the cut and make it look better than before.
    3a/3b coarse and thick.....big and red

    Advanced Deva inspired Stylist
  • bigredapmibigredapmi Posts: 229Registered Users
    Greencurls wrote: »
    I am a bit confused about the different "elevations" when cutting layers.

    A while back I asked my stylist for layers, and she held my hair up straight above my head and cut--something I had never seen before in my life! The results weren't very good. Not sure I can explain.

    Later on, I asked for a different style with slightly stacked layers all over. (Is this a good style for curlies?) She held my hair out at 90 degrees, I think, and that ended up with a cut that looked much better.

    Then I read here that we should be asking for a 45 degree elevation for layers, and nothing higher than that.

    So, I am confused. Can you explain the elevation thing and how it works, and how it makes a difference in how the layering turns out? Thanks!

    K, I'm gonna try :pl:
    The higher the hair is held, the shorter the top layers will be. Now I will do this sometimes in certian places to get some volume for a certian look. Go ahead and take a few curls, pull them up high and imagine where them cut straight across. While still holding on to them bring your hand down to where they would lay. Is that what you want?
    What Tiffiny was talking about, 45 degree angle, was a basic deva cut. Keeping the hair low keeps the weight at the bottom, which is what most curlies want. Anything higher means more layers. With a wet cut this can lead to the triangle, the curls lay on top of each other stacking up. Remember we are talking about straight angles on a round head, your stylist needs to think through how each of those layers will fall when released.
    I am not sure if I explaned this well, or confused you more, but I am moving my hands in the air to show you what I am talking about Lol.
    3a/3b coarse and thick.....big and red

    Advanced Deva inspired Stylist
  • GreencurlsGreencurls Posts: 81Registered Users
    Thanks for the reply! A few questions:

    What elevation should I ask for with a non-deva cut? 45 or 90, or are either okay?

    Is a cut with slightly stacked layers all around (with weight line at eye level) a good choice for a curly? How are stacked layers cut?

    Thanks!
  • GreencurlsGreencurls Posts: 81Registered Users
    Bumping up again.
  • 2b or not 2b2b or not 2b Posts: 15Registered Users
    bumping with a QUOTE in case that makes it more noticeable...I'm curious of the answer to Greencurls questions too...

    bigredapmi wrote: »
    Greencurls wrote: »
    I am a bit confused about the different "elevations" when cutting layers.

    A while back I asked my stylist for layers, and she held my hair up straight above my head and cut--something I had never seen before in my life! The results weren't very good. Not sure I can explain.

    Later on, I asked for a different style with slightly stacked layers all over. (Is this a good style for curlies?) She held my hair out at 90 degrees, I think, and that ended up with a cut that looked much better.

    Then I read here that we should be asking for a 45 degree elevation for layers, and nothing higher than that.

    So, I am confused. Can you explain the elevation thing and how it works, and how it makes a difference in how the layering turns out? Thanks!

    K, I'm gonna try :pl:
    The higher the hair is held, the shorter the top layers will be. Now I will do this sometimes in certian places to get some volume for a certian look. Go ahead and take a few curls, pull them up high and imagine where them cut straight across. While still holding on to them bring your hand down to where they would lay. Is that what you want?
    What Tiffiny was talking about, 45 degree angle, was a basic deva cut. Keeping the hair low keeps the weight at the bottom, which is what most curlies want. Anything higher means more layers. With a wet cut this can lead to the triangle, the curls lay on top of each other stacking up. Remember we are talking about straight angles on a round head, your stylist needs to think through how each of those layers will fall when released.
    I am not sure if I explaned this well, or confused you more, but I am moving my hands in the air to show you what I am talking about Lol.
  • bigredapmibigredapmi Posts: 229Registered Users
    <3
    3a/3b coarse and thick.....big and red

    Advanced Deva inspired Stylist
  • MyrnaMyrna Posts: 2,332Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Hiya, Red, its so great that you are asking us for information and feedback. A+, Curlfriend.

    What I want to tell my stylist is 1. I use the Deva method, more or less, and I love the Deva cut (and having my hair cut dry); but I only use the foaming styler of the Deva line. That is the ONLY product I am currently using to style, and the only one of the Deva line that works for me; I hate producty hair, and I consider myself lucky that only one styling product works well for me, especially in this beastly weather we are having.
    2. I like how I style my hair. I use roller jaw clips. You dont have them? How do you feel if I bring them? for that matter, how do you feel if I bring the products that i have discovered (after spending half my life on naturallycurly.com) that work for me. Are you OK with that?
    3. I would also like to tell my stylist to tell me up front what the cost will be for the services she is providing. I was recently charged a lot more than I had anticipated for a service I did not feel I received. A lot of us are on a tight budget. No big surprises, please.
    4. While I dont want my stylist to feel that I am telling her how to do her job, I do know what works regarding products and styling. I need her expertise in cutting, and in coloring; not necessarily in use of products or styling. This is the part that I dont know how to communicate in words that will not make her feel defensive, and will not leave me feeling like I overstepped. Thanks, Red.
  • bigredapmibigredapmi Posts: 229Registered Users
    Myrna wrote: »
    Hiya, Red, its so great that you are asking us for information and feedback. A+, Curlfriend.

    What I want to tell my stylist is 1. I use the Deva method, more or less, and I love the Deva cut (and having my hair cut dry); but I only use the foaming styler of the Deva line. That is the ONLY product I am currently using to style, and the only one of the Deva line that works for me; I hate producty hair, and I consider myself lucky that only one styling product works well for me, especially in this beastly weather we are having.

    You are lucky indeed :)



    2. I like how I style my hair. I use roller jaw clips. You dont have them? How do you feel if I bring them? for that matter, how do you feel if I bring the products that i have discovered (after spending half my life on naturallycurly.com) that work for me. Are you OK with that?

    I am so o.k. with that!! I often learn just as much from clients as n.c. com and other curly sites. I want what my clients want and I love to play with new things.


    3. I would also like to tell my stylist to tell me up front what the cost will be for the services she is providing. I was recently charged a lot more than I had anticipated for a service I did not feel I received. A lot of us are on a tight budget. No big surprises, please.

    Point taken <3


    4. While I dont want my stylist to feel that I am telling her how to do her job, I do know what works regarding products and styling. I need her expertise in cutting, and in coloring; not necessarily in use of products or styling. This is the part that I dont know how to communicate in words that will not make her feel defensive, and will not leave me feeling like I overstepped. Thanks, Red.


    Tell me what works for you, and I can tell you what works for me, and then we can both learn from each other. That is the fun of being a curly stylist!!
    Myrna, you are not overstepping your bounds. If you were to sit in my chair, you would then become my boss. You are paying me for my services, I want to do what you want, and give you what you need.
    3a/3b coarse and thick.....big and red

    Advanced Deva inspired Stylist
  • 2b or not 2b2b or not 2b Posts: 15Registered Users
    Greencurls wrote: »
    A few questions:

    What elevation should I ask for with a non-deva cut? 45 or 90, or are either okay?

    Is a cut with slightly stacked layers all around (with weight line at eye level) a good choice for a curly? How are stacked layers cut?

    Thanks!


    so I'm not familiar with the phrase elevation in regard to cutting hair, I get what GreenCurls means I think but is that a good way to refer to it to a stylist? and if elevation is a common stylist term, what elevation would you recommend for a non-deva, dry cut? by elevation would you be referring to the overall angle of the haircut or the angle that each curl is cut at?

    as for the stacked all around GreenCurls, i think it can be super cute for curls.(google curly or wavy inverted or stacked bob or else go to this link i just saw...cute stacked curls:)
    I am curious also though about how it is actually created by cutting each curl individually whereas an inverted/stacked bob on straight hair is more or less just cutting at an angle so that the hair is shorter on the bottom and blends in to the longer hair at the top-how's that for non-technical description of a haircut(i've given that cut before even...i just dont know how to describe it as i'm not formally trained)

    anyway, is that cut just done by "eyeing it up" when done via Devacut?

    Thanks for your insights!
  • MyrnaMyrna Posts: 2,332Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    You are the best, Red, I wish more stylists had your open attitude.
  • bigredapmibigredapmi Posts: 229Registered Users
    Greencurls wrote: »
    A few questions:

    What elevation should I ask for with a non-deva cut? 45 or 90, or are either okay?

    Is a cut with slightly stacked layers all around (with weight line at eye level) a good choice for a curly? How are stacked layers cut?

    Thanks!


    so I'm not familiar with the phrase elevation in regard to cutting hair, I get what GreenCurls means I think but is that a good way to refer to it to a stylist? and if elevation is a common stylist term, what elevation would you recommend for a non-deva, dry cut? by elevation would you be referring to the overall angle of the haircut or the angle that each curl is cut at?

    as for the stacked all around GreenCurls, i think it can be super cute for curls.(google curly or wavy inverted or stacked bob or else go to this link i just saw...cute stacked curls:)
    I am curious also though about how it is actually created by cutting each curl individually whereas an inverted/stacked bob on straight hair is more or less just cutting at an angle so that the hair is shorter on the bottom and blends in to the longer hair at the top-how's that for non-technical description of a haircut(i've given that cut before even...i just dont know how to describe it as i'm not formally trained)

    anyway, is that cut just done by "eyeing it up" when done via Devacut?

    Thanks for your insights!


    The elevation really depends on the shape of the style you want and the shape of your head. Most cuts for curlies want weight and length at the bottom so we use a low elevation. But for shorter styles, height at the crown ect. we use higher elevation.

    Stacked bobs are the opposite. We take the weight out of the bottom, at the angle we want to achieve.

    There is no just eyeballing it :) lol
    3a/3b coarse and thick.....big and red

    Advanced Deva inspired Stylist
  • NejNej Posts: 2,444Registered Users
    layers are not always the answer
    anigif_enhanced-buzz-2027-1364839025-19.gif