Hair Products and Their Bases

2456719

Comments

  • EllyEllyOxenFreeEllyEllyOxenFree Posts: 6,446Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    You're welcome!!! Shout out to coilynapp - not sure where she is but we were discussing this yesterday. :albino:
    BC'ed: 26 Dec 09
    YouTube
    Grand Duchess Fierce Freckles, Mistress of the Mighty Snap and Doyenne of the Potent Products Pavane in the Order of the Curly Crusaders
  • Nappy_curly_crownNappy_curly_crown Posts: 4,162Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    This might not be the base she uses for the butters...but I think its DAYUM close....
    Wanna talk products? Come Join us here!
    http://www.facebook.com/PlatinumPJ

    Extremely thick, kinky curls/coils that have a mind of thier own!!!!
    _____________________________
    I like my men and my hair....KINKY!!!!
    _____________________________
    Wanna save $10 off your next purchase at vitacost.com? Use my referal code (click the link)!


    12459237.png
    Created by MyFitnessPal.com - Free Calorie Counter
  • afrosheenqueenafrosheenqueen Posts: 5,400Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    finehair wrote: »
    Afroveda's Holy Basil, Coconut Moisture, Neem, Kissi, Nu Milk, and Emu are made from this base. You can add ingredients or herbs as you like. http://www.ingredientstodiefor.com/item.php?item_id=102&category_id=53

    Her other conditioners are from the Cetyl Alcohol, Stearyl Alcohol (together these are called Cetearyl, the name she uses), Stearalkonium Chloride, Dimethyl Stearamine, Lactic Acid type of base I mentioned above.

    Mala also gets NatureMulse, the emulsifier she uses for her butters, from here as well. I bought some to experiment with. :evil4:


    I think Mala uses a base for her butters too.
    Only thing different in her butters are the oils/essential oil blend she uses.

    I was wondering that too but I could never find it. I found the emulsifier she uses that I referenced above. This is another one - http://www.makingcosmetics.com/Emulsifiers/CreamMaker-MIX-p40.html
    4a/b Texlaxed hair w/ highlights. Medium texture & high porosity.

    HG's: CJ Daily Fix, Bobeam Cheris Hibiscus shampoo bar, KC Spiral Spritz, Knot Today, CJ Rehab, KBB LL Hair Mask, Cassia, KCCC, oil blend of Avocado, Camellia, Jojoba, & Meadowfoam oils

    SL APL BSL MBL
  • hippychichippychic Posts: 4,673Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    good gawd!!! i hope she wasn't using silicones :evil1:
    LOIS (OS); cottony, TYPE 4 hair, fine/med strands; no cones bcz my hair hates them; last relaxer '98; now low porosity:?, ignores most natural hair rules; BC #8

    faves: suave, v05 shampoo, conditioner (my own), raw shea butter, castor oil, peanut oil, aloe juice
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • afrosheenqueenafrosheenqueen Posts: 5,400Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    artemis wrote: »

    Plus there is a difference between "private label agreements" and companies selling the same product manufactured in the same facility under different brands with different price points. Private label agreements are when a formulator stikes a deal with someone what a manufacturing facility to mass product a product for them. The formulator retains EXCLUSIVE rights to the formula, and the owner of the facility gets a flat manufacturing payment.

    +1. Plus, a dry blend containing fatty alcohols and an emulsifier isn't a base per se. You have to add the water, oils, herbs, preservative, etc yourself making it a unique formula. Bulk liquid, cream and butter bases are pre-fabricated formulas that already contain all the water, oils, herbs, preservative, etc needed. The customer only needs to add scent to finish. Naturmulse is an emulsifier like BTMS and a million others out there which every emulsion needs, commercial or handmade. Without an emulsifier the product will separate.

    Right. I think she does hand make her butters using the same emulsifiers.

    Her conditioners on the other hand seem to be just bases with stuff added.
    4a/b Texlaxed hair w/ highlights. Medium texture & high porosity.

    HG's: CJ Daily Fix, Bobeam Cheris Hibiscus shampoo bar, KC Spiral Spritz, Knot Today, CJ Rehab, KBB LL Hair Mask, Cassia, KCCC, oil blend of Avocado, Camellia, Jojoba, & Meadowfoam oils

    SL APL BSL MBL
  • ReekyReeky Posts: 1,323Registered Users
    Thank you Elle! This is exactly what I neeeeed.

    Im at the point where, like you said.. "If you aint got a manufacturer I aint f*kn witcha!" im over these small companies and their drama. Id love to support my small [black] businesses but I dont feel like I get the same energy back. I cant deal with them getting a little success and losing their minds. You gotta wait weeks for your things, to sometimes receive retarded products.. then deal with bad/half ass customer service and so on and so forth. Also, my refrigerator is filling up and its not with food.. if your not preserving your stuff to where it does not mutate in normal weather im not buying it anymore. Im actually going through more money trying to use product up before it goes bad, nope!

    I still have certain companies that I will patronize until they cross me lol, cause at this point good customer service gets you SO far with me. & those companies (KBN, Curl Junkie, Darcys etc.) need to give out lessons to these others on that.

    Like I told Elle yesterday, im rounding out my staples.. and am going to start buying some things in bulk/large sizes. Ill still pay for what my hair likes.. but im saving where I can. Ive already got friends (& my mom lol) to split costs with me and ive got a fridge full of oils and other extras to spice this ish up myself.
    Im not mad at the companies who buy bases at all, do you! hustle by any means.. I dont even care if you lie and say you mixed it yourself, but let me find the website you got it from & its a wrap..

    .. as I proceed to browse a few of the above LOL, im on it!

    p.s. i know somebody is maaad at this thread phaaaaaa
    dense, fine & porous curls |

    Poo/Cowash| Bobeam, V05 Shea Cashmere
    DC| AOGPB, CJ Repair Me, BrownButterBeauty
    RinseOut| Mill Creek Keratin Conditioner, Ology Moisturizing Conditioner
    Leave In| Curl Rehab, Bee Mine Luscious Balanced Moisturizer, CJ Smoothing Lotion
    Moisturize|Oyin Hair Dew, CR Moisture Milk
    Gel| Kiss My Face UMG, Trader Joes Aloe Vera, KCCC
    Sealants| Aloe Juice, Whipped Shea, Cocoa & Mango Butters, Castor, & my Peanut Oil Blend =)
  • Nappy_curly_crownNappy_curly_crown Posts: 4,162Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    yeah I can't find a base that similiar enough to her butters to say she uses a base...plus I think if they were bases, we wouldn't have the seperation issues and such. But since she adds that rice milk, I think that's what causes the rotten smell...she's not preserving them well enough to account for the milk.
    Wanna talk products? Come Join us here!
    http://www.facebook.com/PlatinumPJ

    Extremely thick, kinky curls/coils that have a mind of thier own!!!!
    _____________________________
    I like my men and my hair....KINKY!!!!
    _____________________________
    Wanna save $10 off your next purchase at vitacost.com? Use my referal code (click the link)!


    12459237.png
    Created by MyFitnessPal.com - Free Calorie Counter
  • sassywillowsassywillow Posts: 829Registered Users
    ellepixie wrote: »
    The Prana conditioner and the BARE conditioner are bases. I did a google on the ingredients minus the herbs and oils and I found several conditioners out there with the same exact base. What is disturbing is that Mala lists an ingredient called silica. In the other products with the same base this ingredient is listed as Dimethicone (from Silica). Does this mean that her conditoners have a cone in them and she is misleading customers???

    No, silica is good for hair, it's like horsetail - a strengthener. Can you list the ingredients though for the base? She might be...

    Found it. Here's the link to the conditioner base

    http://www.dreamingearth.com/ingredients.html another company that uses the same base with ginger added to it.
    Ah...to be a well pampered pootiecat. I can sleep on my owner's lap. Roll over on my back when I want my stomach rubbed. Purr with delight. Suddenly jump off and walk away for no reason. Not respond when I am called. Throw my leg up and lick with intense abandon. Sleep 85% of the time. Hang my head off the couch and view the world upside down.:laughing5:
  • EllyEllyOxenFreeEllyEllyOxenFree Posts: 6,446Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    And they can be mad...when you come with this sob story:

    I began making my own skincare products because I couldn't find any that performed the way I needed and wanted them to. I was disappointed when I paid for something that promised all day moisture and didn't deliver. Aside from my own needs and of even greater concern to me was my son's skin. He has had a mild case of recurring eczema since he was a toddler. For years, he suffered with dry skin that was thirsty for gentle, long-lasting moisture. I was unable to find anything that could deliver essential moisture for both of us, so the quest to create the perfect body lotion began. I read and researched everything I could find on organic, plant based skin care.

    I began experimenting with various ingredients and finally, created my own line of natural, organic skin care products, which I now present to you. My formerly dry skin has responded exceedingly well to the daily use of my exfoliating scrubs, bath milks, nourishing sea salts and body creams. I am most thrilled to announce that my son's skin is now healthy and vibrant! Our knowledgeable dermatologist advised us that the best way to treat and manage eczema is to keep the skin properly and thoroughly moisturized. His eczema is in remission and completely under control: he keeps it moisturized with "Mommy's stuff". Treating my adult acne: organic alternatives that made a difference. I met my dermatologist when I was seeking treatment for adult onset acne.

    And you sell this: Phat Head Coconut Pudding with Silk Protein for $8 for 6oz

    Ingredients
    Organic Aloe Juice, Organic Coconut Oil, Emulsifying Wax, Palm Stearic Acid, Kosher Vegetable Glycerin, Organic Jojoba Oil, Organic Grapeseed Oil, Organic Avocado Oil, Organic Witch Hazel, Vitamin E, Phenoxyethanol, Hydrolyzed Silk, Xanthan Gum, Organic Black Willowbark Extract, Neem Oil, Rosemary Oleoresin, Citric Acid

    Then we find this: EW Silk Creme 16oz for $11.15
    Ingredients/Tech Specs:
    Aloe barbadensis (Organic Aloe) Juice, Cocos nucifera (Organic Coconut) Oil, Emulsifying Wax NF, Palm Stearic Acid, Kosher Vegetable Glycerin, Simmondsia chinensis (Jojoba) Oil, Vitis vinifera (Grapeseed) Oil, Persea americana (Avocado) Oil, Hamamelis virginiana (Witch Hazel), Tocopherol (Vitamin E), Phenoxyethanol, Hydrolyzed Silk, Xanthan Gum (Polysaccharide Gum), Salix nigra (Organic Black Willowbark) Extract, Mannan, Azadirachta indica (Neem) Oil, Rosmarinus officinalis (Rosemary) Oleoresin, Tetrasodium EDTA, Citric Acid

    Just sayin.
    BC'ed: 26 Dec 09
    YouTube
    Grand Duchess Fierce Freckles, Mistress of the Mighty Snap and Doyenne of the Potent Products Pavane in the Order of the Curly Crusaders
  • LhoreSpencerLhoreSpencer Posts: 474Registered Users
    Duchess of Curls (amourai) is also EW Simple Aloe Jelly as well if I recall correctly.

    I purchased this in a co-op with Goobernut back in May. It's the EXACT same thing, only difference is the scent added.
    Shipping can be tough on the pockets unless you purchase a lot of items. I remember when I was reading thru that sight and the thread for the co-op, so many ladies pointed out different bases that are sold to the public. They even offer skin care items as well.
    Funny how I didn't remember this until you posted this.
    FdQlm4.png
    Falling deeper and deeper and deeper in :love4: with my beautiful mixture of springy, tight coils and super duper kinks.

    *SIGH* Alas, I've come to accept my shrinkage and fairy knots :angry7:

    There are no magic potions, concoctions, elixirs, or pills for hair growth, weight loss, or financial independence... so stop looking for a quick fix!!!
  • coilynappcoilynapp Posts: 4,233Registered Users
    artemis wrote: »

    Plus there is a difference between "private label agreements" and companies selling the same product manufactured in the same facility under different brands with different price points. Private label agreements are when a formulator stikes a deal with someone what a manufacturing facility to mass product a product for them. The formulator retains EXCLUSIVE rights to the formula, and the owner of the facility gets a flat manufacturing payment.

    +1. Plus, a dry blend containing fatty alcohols and an emulsifier isn't a base per se. You have to add the water, oils, herbs, preservative, etc yourself making it a unique formula. Bulk liquid, cream and butter bases are pre-fabricated formulas that already contain all the water, oils, herbs, preservative, etc needed. The customer only needs to add scent to finish. Naturmulse is an emulsifier like BTMS and a million others out there which every emulsion needs, commercial or handmade. Without an emulsifier the product will separate.
    using a blend of emulsifiers is not the same as a base. Otherwise, we can say that everyone who uses BTMS is using a base and that's not true at all. A base is an emulsion (in the case of conditioner or lotion) that is created in bulk and all you need to do is add fragrance and preservative (and sometimes just fragrance)
    th?id=H.4940802350254088&pid=1.7&w=183&h=144&c=7&rs=1
  • EllyEllyOxenFreeEllyEllyOxenFree Posts: 6,446Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Duchess of Curls (amourai) is also EW Simple Aloe Jelly as well if I recall correctly.

    I purchased this in a co-op with Goobernut back in May. It's the EXACT same thing, only difference is the scent added.
    Shipping can be tough on the pockets unless you purchase a lot of items. I remember when I was reading thru that sight and the thread for the co-op, so many ladies pointed out different bases that are sold to the public. They even offer skin care items as well.
    Funny how I didn't remember this until you posted this.

    Wait Lhore so is $11 expensive? I'm confused now.
    BC'ed: 26 Dec 09
    YouTube
    Grand Duchess Fierce Freckles, Mistress of the Mighty Snap and Doyenne of the Potent Products Pavane in the Order of the Curly Crusaders
  • CoilsKinksCurlsCoilsKinksCurls Posts: 418Registered Users
    It might be a bse because remember in the other thread we were saying she could be infusing the herbs in oil and then use the oils in the base causing it to separate because there aren't enough emulsifiers to compensate for the new oils added.

    The she said she was going to start adding xanthun gum to help keep the oils from separating and you can mix the herb infused oils and xanthun gum together and then whip it into the butters quite easy.

    What do you think?


    yeah I can't find a base that similiar enough to her butters to say she uses a base...plus I think if they were bases, we wouldn't have the seperation issues and such. But since she adds that rice milk, I think that's what causes the rotten smell...she's not preserving them well enough to account for the milk.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

    Check Out my YouTube Channel:
    http://www.youtube.com/user/CoilsKinksCurls



    Hair Type: 4a

    It's not bad being a product junkie, when it benefits someone else!
    Don't like it, just keep walkin!!
    :walk:
  • NaturalistaNaturalista Posts: 5,491Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Perhaps I'm thinking too diabolically, but if you were to mix a shealoe bulk base with a creme lotion base, add your milk/oils whatever then voila. Plus editing the ingredients a tad to cover your tracks and no one has to be the wiser. It's all a tad close.. possibly..

    There is a natural supply bulk store in TX where she resides that has a whipped shealoe and some creme lotion base (concentrate one in particular) that if mixed together would create that consistency.

    http://www.texasnaturalsupply.com/productinfo.aspx?productid=ANCLBC1 PLUS

    http://www.texasnaturalsupply.com/productinfo.aspx?productid=SHEALOEB

    just being diabolical...LOL!!

    NCC: I saw that base as well, do you think that somehow she could be mixing bases, off setting the pH with the rice milk/other additives and adding additional preservative--could explain the colors, the inconsistencies, etc. I saw that you're a chemist and it was my college major, but that was as deep as I went into it. LOL!!
    Type: 3c with some 4a highlighted
    Low porosity thick/coarse texture. nml elasticity
    Routine: No rules, just happy hair

    Cleanse: CJDF, Prell, LUSH Curly Wurly, Bobeam
    LI/RO:BBB, CJ, SheaM, HEHIS, Garnier, KBN Shealoe, CD Chocolat, Oyin HH
    Styling: CJ, CR, UFD, Zuresh, Ecostyler,MJ
    PT/DT: BBB, CJ, Lather, MJSSB

    HUGE PJJJJJJJJ!!!!:love4:

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]]
    Facebook|Twitter
  • NaturalistaNaturalista Posts: 5,491Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    It might be a bse because remember in the other thread we were saying she could be infusing the herbs in oil and then use the oils in the base causing it to separate because there aren't enough emulsifiers to compensate for the new oils added.

    The she said she was going to start adding xanthun gum to help keep the oils from separating and you can mix the herb infused oils and xanthun gum together and then whip it into the butters quite easy.

    What do you think?

    "Herbal Oil Complex" she states could be:

    http://www.texasnaturalsupply.com/productinfo.aspx?productid=IREOB
    Type: 3c with some 4a highlighted
    Low porosity thick/coarse texture. nml elasticity
    Routine: No rules, just happy hair

    Cleanse: CJDF, Prell, LUSH Curly Wurly, Bobeam
    LI/RO:BBB, CJ, SheaM, HEHIS, Garnier, KBN Shealoe, CD Chocolat, Oyin HH
    Styling: CJ, CR, UFD, Zuresh, Ecostyler,MJ
    PT/DT: BBB, CJ, Lather, MJSSB

    HUGE PJJJJJJJJ!!!!:love4:

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]]
    Facebook|Twitter
  • coilynappcoilynapp Posts: 4,233Registered Users
    ellepixie wrote: »
    You're welcome!!! Shout out to coilynapp - not sure where she is but we were discussing this yesterday. :albino:
    Elle, :hello2: I'm here, just been reading.

    I see we've starting some fire up in here...
    th?id=H.4940802350254088&pid=1.7&w=183&h=144&c=7&rs=1
  • coilynappcoilynapp Posts: 4,233Registered Users
    This might not be the base she uses for the butters...but I think its DAYUM close....
    she doesn't use emulsifying wax, she uses Glyceryl Stearate (and) Cetearyl Alcohol (and) Sodium Stearoyl Lactylate (which is naturemulse, ecomulse just to name a couple of names). I don't think her butters are bases, but I could be wrong
    th?id=H.4940802350254088&pid=1.7&w=183&h=144&c=7&rs=1
  • afrosheenqueenafrosheenqueen Posts: 5,400Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    It might be a bse because remember in the other thread we were saying she could be infusing the herbs in oil and then use the oils in the base causing it to separate because there aren't enough emulsifiers to compensate for the new oils added.

    What do you think?

    I think your on to something. Things aren't right. She might not NEED to add extra things to those conditioner bases but I think she is to make it her own.
    4a/b Texlaxed hair w/ highlights. Medium texture & high porosity.

    HG's: CJ Daily Fix, Bobeam Cheris Hibiscus shampoo bar, KC Spiral Spritz, Knot Today, CJ Rehab, KBB LL Hair Mask, Cassia, KCCC, oil blend of Avocado, Camellia, Jojoba, & Meadowfoam oils

    SL APL BSL MBL
  • finehairfinehair Posts: 81Registered Users
    Perhaps I'm thinking too diabolically, but if you were to mix a shealoe bulk base with a creme lotion base, add your milk/oils whatever then voila. Plus editing the ingredients a tad to cover your tracks and no one has to be the wiser. It's all a tad close.. possibly..

    There is a natural supply bulk store in TX where she resides that has a whipped shealoe and some creme lotion base (concentrate one in particular) that if mixed together would create that consistency.

    http://www.texasnaturalsupply.com/productinfo.aspx?productid=ANCLBC1 PLUS

    http://www.texasnaturalsupply.com/productinfo.aspx?productid=SHEALOEB

    just being diabolical...LOL!!

    NCC: I saw that base as well, do you think that somehow she could be mixing bases, off setting the pH with the rice milk/other additives and adding additional preservative--could explain the colors, the inconsistencies, etc. I saw that you're a chemist and it was my college major, but that was as deep as I went into it. LOL!!


    LOL... goodness.
    Did you read some of the comments under the base reviews:

    Stars5.gif
    I've had a great time using the creme, mixing in my "special" ingredients and WOW....I'm thrilled with the results. I might start a business of my own.
    Stars5.gif
    This a wonderful base to body and hair butters.
  • EllyEllyOxenFreeEllyEllyOxenFree Posts: 6,446Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    I don't think they are bases because they aren't consistent...if she only had to add a few things to it I would hope that she'd measure it correctly...but, I will say that I'm not sure she is putting in all the work she claims to in order to make it from scratch.
    BC'ed: 26 Dec 09
    YouTube
    Grand Duchess Fierce Freckles, Mistress of the Mighty Snap and Doyenne of the Potent Products Pavane in the Order of the Curly Crusaders
  • NaturalistaNaturalista Posts: 5,491Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    coilynapp wrote: »
    This might not be the base she uses for the butters...but I think its DAYUM close....
    she doesn't use emulsifying wax, she uses Glyceryl Stearate (and) Cetearyl Alcohol (and) Sodium Stearoyl Lactylate (which is naturemulse, ecomulse just to name a couple of names). I don't think her butters are bases, but I could be wrong

    According to HER, she doesn't use it-- but we could all be wrong. Also, once she disturbs the base by changing the consistency with oils and rice milk, SOMETHING has to bring it all back together. So perhaps she's double dipping and that's where the second emulsifier comes in?? Oils falling out of solution and such, it could be why.

    I'm being devious... LOL!!
    Type: 3c with some 4a highlighted
    Low porosity thick/coarse texture. nml elasticity
    Routine: No rules, just happy hair

    Cleanse: CJDF, Prell, LUSH Curly Wurly, Bobeam
    LI/RO:BBB, CJ, SheaM, HEHIS, Garnier, KBN Shealoe, CD Chocolat, Oyin HH
    Styling: CJ, CR, UFD, Zuresh, Ecostyler,MJ
    PT/DT: BBB, CJ, Lather, MJSSB

    HUGE PJJJJJJJJ!!!!:love4:

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]]
    Facebook|Twitter
  • Nappy_curly_crownNappy_curly_crown Posts: 4,162Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    Perhaps I'm thinking too diabolically, but if you were to mix a shealoe bulk base with a creme lotion base, add your milk/oils whatever then voila. Plus editing the ingredients a tad to cover your tracks and no one has to be the wiser. It's all a tad close.. possibly..

    There is a natural supply bulk store in TX where she resides that has a whipped shealoe and some creme lotion base (concentrate one in particular) that if mixed together would create that consistency.

    http://www.texasnaturalsupply.com/productinfo.aspx?productid=ANCLBC1 PLUS

    http://www.texasnaturalsupply.com/productinfo.aspx?productid=SHEALOEB

    just being diabolical...LOL!!

    NCC: I saw that base as well, do you think that somehow she could be mixing bases, off setting the pH with the rice milk/other additives and adding additional preservative--could explain the colors, the inconsistencies, etc. I saw that you're a chemist and it was my college major, but that was as deep as I went into it. LOL!!


    I was thinking that she's mixing bases (not very well) and then adding inflused oils/rice milk which might account for the seperation and/or rotten smell from the spoiled milk. If you look at her oils that she sells, I think those are the "infused oils" that she's adding to her butters, espically that growth exlixer. It's got pretty much every herb that she says is in her butters in it.

    I think the butters are partly a base....I just need to sit down a bit and reverse engineer her stuff (which I usually don't like to do for ethical reasons but oh well). Give me a day or two and I can tell u exactly what bases she's using and what additional ingredients she's adding. We already know most of the herbal extracts are added. I need to figure out which oils are added later and BOOM. I'm about 50% sure she's using a generic shea butter body butter base and working from there is adding stuff.
    Wanna talk products? Come Join us here!
    http://www.facebook.com/PlatinumPJ

    Extremely thick, kinky curls/coils that have a mind of thier own!!!!
    _____________________________
    I like my men and my hair....KINKY!!!!
    _____________________________
    Wanna save $10 off your next purchase at vitacost.com? Use my referal code (click the link)!


    12459237.png
    Created by MyFitnessPal.com - Free Calorie Counter
  • coilynappcoilynapp Posts: 4,233Registered Users
    coilynapp wrote: »
    This might not be the base she uses for the butters...but I think its DAYUM close....
    she doesn't use emulsifying wax, she uses Glyceryl Stearate (and) Cetearyl Alcohol (and) Sodium Stearoyl Lactylate (which is naturemulse, ecomulse just to name a couple of names). I don't think her butters are bases, but I could be wrong

    According to HER, she doesn't use it-- but we could all be wrong. Also, once she disturbs the base by changing the consistency with oils and rice milk, SOMETHING has to bring it all back together. So perhaps she's double dipping and that's where the second emulsifier comes in?? Oils falling out of solution and such, it could be why.

    I'm being devious... LOL!!
    If she is using a base, she would not be adding another emulsifier. That would mean heating the base and with a preservative already in it, that will make the preservative not effective anymore.

    IA with Elle. If it was a base, her butters would be at least consistent. When using bases, people don't add an excess of 5% of stuff into it (I think I'm remembering this correctly, don't remember where I read this). You can't do that or you will make everything unstable. In order to add any solids, you would have to heat the base to the melting point of the new solid (e.g., emulsifier) usually 65 C or more, at which point the preservative and all other heat sensitive ingredients in the base, are not effective anymore

    Also, emulsifying wax feels very different from something like ecomulse. E-wax is very waxy-feeling and you would not be getting that smooth, wet like feel with it, as you do with ecomulse. So, no, I don't think she uses e-wax at all. I've used both emulsifiers and I would not be putting e-wax in my hair because it's too waxy for me (every product I've tried that has used e-wax as an emulsifier left my hair feeling waxy and coated--beautiful curls leave in, sheamoisture curl and style milk for example)
    th?id=H.4940802350254088&pid=1.7&w=183&h=144&c=7&rs=1
  • hippychichippychic Posts: 4,673Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    i don't like the feel of ewax in my hair. too much drag.
    if afroveda is using bases and doing all of this doctoring, it would be so much easier to formulate from scratch and perfect her recipe/batches. :lovestory:
    LOIS (OS); cottony, TYPE 4 hair, fine/med strands; no cones bcz my hair hates them; last relaxer '98; now low porosity:?, ignores most natural hair rules; BC #8

    faves: suave, v05 shampoo, conditioner (my own), raw shea butter, castor oil, peanut oil, aloe juice
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • Nappy_curly_crownNappy_curly_crown Posts: 4,162Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    coilynapp wrote: »
    coilynapp wrote: »
    she doesn't use emulsifying wax, she uses Glyceryl Stearate (and) Cetearyl Alcohol (and) Sodium Stearoyl Lactylate (which is naturemulse, ecomulse just to name a couple of names). I don't think her butters are bases, but I could be wrong

    According to HER, she doesn't use it-- but we could all be wrong. Also, once she disturbs the base by changing the consistency with oils and rice milk, SOMETHING has to bring it all back together. So perhaps she's double dipping and that's where the second emulsifier comes in?? Oils falling out of solution and such, it could be why.

    I'm being devious... LOL!!
    If she is using a base, she would not be adding another emulsifier. That would mean heating the base and with a preservative already in it, that will make the preservative not effective anymore.

    IA with Elle. If it was a base, her butters would be at least consistent. When using bases, people don't add an excess of 5% of stuff into it (I think I'm remembering this correctly, don't remember where I read this). You can't do that or you will make everything unstable. In order to add any solids, you would have to heat the base to the melting point of the new solid (e.g., emulsifier) usually 65 C or more, at which point the preservative and all other heat sensitive ingredients in the base, are not effective anymore

    Also, emulsifying wax feels very different from something like ecomulse. E-wax is very waxy-feeling and you would not be getting that smooth, wet like feel with it, as you do with ecomulse. So, no, I don't think she uses e-wax at all. I've used both emulsifiers and I would not be putting e-wax in my hair because it's too waxy for me (every product I've tried that has used e-wax as an emulsifier left my hair feeling waxy and coated--beautiful curls leave in, sheamoisture curl and style milk for example)

    BINGO. Maybe that's why her butters are molding and/or smelling funny and people are complaining about the consistency issue. You've got to admit, when she first started out, i don't recall ANYONE complaining about stuff getting moldy fast or about them seperating. Once she started added more stuff to her butters and changing the ingredients,...that's when the complaints started.
    Wanna talk products? Come Join us here!
    http://www.facebook.com/PlatinumPJ

    Extremely thick, kinky curls/coils that have a mind of thier own!!!!
    _____________________________
    I like my men and my hair....KINKY!!!!
    _____________________________
    Wanna save $10 off your next purchase at vitacost.com? Use my referal code (click the link)!


    12459237.png
    Created by MyFitnessPal.com - Free Calorie Counter
  • sassywillowsassywillow Posts: 829Registered Users
    coilynapp wrote: »

    According to HER, she doesn't use it-- but we could all be wrong. Also, once she disturbs the base by changing the consistency with oils and rice milk, SOMETHING has to bring it all back together. So perhaps she's double dipping and that's where the second emulsifier comes in?? Oils falling out of solution and such, it could be why.

    I'm being devious... LOL!!
    If she is using a base, she would not be adding another emulsifier. That would mean heating the base and with a preservative already in it, that will make the preservative not effective anymore.

    IA with Elle. If it was a base, her butters would be at least consistent. When using bases, people don't add an excess of 5% of stuff into it (I think I'm remembering this correctly, don't remember where I read this). You can't do that or you will make everything unstable. In order to add any solids, you would have to heat the base to the melting point of the new solid (e.g., emulsifier) usually 65 C or more, at which point the preservative and all other heat sensitive ingredients in the base, are not effective anymore

    Also, emulsifying wax feels very different from something like ecomulse. E-wax is very waxy-feeling and you would not be getting that smooth, wet like feel with it, as you do with ecomulse. So, no, I don't think she uses e-wax at all. I've used both emulsifiers and I would not be putting e-wax in my hair because it's too waxy for me (every product I've tried that has used e-wax as an emulsifier left my hair feeling waxy and coated--beautiful curls leave in, sheamoisture curl and style milk for example)

    BINGO. Maybe that's why her butters are molding and/or smelling funny and people are complaining about the consistency issue. You've got to admit, when she first started out, i don't recall ANYONE complaining about stuff getting moldy fast or about them seperating. Once she started added more stuff to her butters and changing the ingredients,...that's when the complaints started.
    Sounds like Mala needs a chemist on staff.
    Ah...to be a well pampered pootiecat. I can sleep on my owner's lap. Roll over on my back when I want my stomach rubbed. Purr with delight. Suddenly jump off and walk away for no reason. Not respond when I am called. Throw my leg up and lick with intense abandon. Sleep 85% of the time. Hang my head off the couch and view the world upside down.:laughing5:
  • hippychichippychic Posts: 4,673Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    coilynapp wrote: »

    According to HER, she doesn't use it-- but we could all be wrong. Also, once she disturbs the base by changing the consistency with oils and rice milk, SOMETHING has to bring it all back together. So perhaps she's double dipping and that's where the second emulsifier comes in?? Oils falling out of solution and such, it could be why.

    I'm being devious... LOL!!
    If she is using a base, she would not be adding another emulsifier. That would mean heating the base and with a preservative already in it, that will make the preservative not effective anymore.

    IA with Elle. If it was a base, her butters would be at least consistent. When using bases, people don't add an excess of 5% of stuff into it (I think I'm remembering this correctly, don't remember where I read this). You can't do that or you will make everything unstable. In order to add any solids, you would have to heat the base to the melting point of the new solid (e.g., emulsifier) usually 65 C or more, at which point the preservative and all other heat sensitive ingredients in the base, are not effective anymore

    Also, emulsifying wax feels very different from something like ecomulse. E-wax is very waxy-feeling and you would not be getting that smooth, wet like feel with it, as you do with ecomulse. So, no, I don't think she uses e-wax at all. I've used both emulsifiers and I would not be putting e-wax in my hair because it's too waxy for me (every product I've tried that has used e-wax as an emulsifier left my hair feeling waxy and coated--beautiful curls leave in, sheamoisture curl and style milk for example)

    BINGO. Maybe that's why her butters are molding and/or smelling funny and people are complaining about the consistency issue. You've got to admit, when she first started out, i don't recall ANYONE complaining about stuff getting moldy fast or about them seperating. Once she started added more stuff to her butters and changing the ingredients,...that's when the complaints started.
    and let's not talk about the chocolate scented shea butter... (scratches head)
    LOIS (OS); cottony, TYPE 4 hair, fine/med strands; no cones bcz my hair hates them; last relaxer '98; now low porosity:?, ignores most natural hair rules; BC #8

    faves: suave, v05 shampoo, conditioner (my own), raw shea butter, castor oil, peanut oil, aloe juice
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • NaturalistaNaturalista Posts: 5,491Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    coilynapp wrote: »

    According to HER, she doesn't use it-- but we could all be wrong. Also, once she disturbs the base by changing the consistency with oils and rice milk, SOMETHING has to bring it all back together. So perhaps she's double dipping and that's where the second emulsifier comes in?? Oils falling out of solution and such, it could be why.

    I'm being devious... LOL!!
    If she is using a base, she would not be adding another emulsifier. That would mean heating the base and with a preservative already in it, that will make the preservative not effective anymore.

    IA with Elle. If it was a base, her butters would be at least consistent. When using bases, people don't add an excess of 5% of stuff into it (I think I'm remembering this correctly, don't remember where I read this). You can't do that or you will make everything unstable. In order to add any solids, you would have to heat the base to the melting point of the new solid (e.g., emulsifier) usually 65 C or more, at which point the preservative and all other heat sensitive ingredients in the base, are not effective anymore

    Also, emulsifying wax feels very different from something like ecomulse. E-wax is very waxy-feeling and you would not be getting that smooth, wet like feel with it, as you do with ecomulse. So, no, I don't think she uses e-wax at all. I've used both emulsifiers and I would not be putting e-wax in my hair because it's too waxy for me (every product I've tried that has used e-wax as an emulsifier left my hair feeling waxy and coated--beautiful curls leave in, sheamoisture curl and style milk for example)

    BINGO. Maybe that's why her butters are molding and/or smelling funny and people are complaining about the consistency issue. You've got to admit, when she first started out, i don't recall ANYONE complaining about stuff getting moldy fast or about them seperating. Once she started added more stuff to her butters and changing the ingredients,...that's when the complaints started.

    Damn!! Beat me to the punch NCC!! ^5!!

    E-wax doesn't have to be all bad. I don't deal in wax, but is it all all or nothing phenomena? How much you need to emulsify is product dependent, and if she's using something additional to emulsify to make the consistency more uniform can you you really predict what you'll get, especially if heat is added to the mix?
    Type: 3c with some 4a highlighted
    Low porosity thick/coarse texture. nml elasticity
    Routine: No rules, just happy hair

    Cleanse: CJDF, Prell, LUSH Curly Wurly, Bobeam
    LI/RO:BBB, CJ, SheaM, HEHIS, Garnier, KBN Shealoe, CD Chocolat, Oyin HH
    Styling: CJ, CR, UFD, Zuresh, Ecostyler,MJ
    PT/DT: BBB, CJ, Lather, MJSSB

    HUGE PJJJJJJJJ!!!!:love4:

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]]
    Facebook|Twitter
  • kathymackkathymack Posts: 9,999Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Here's a similar thread from last winter that "exposes" a lot of products. You've already listed some of them: http://www.naturallycurly.com/curltalk/showthread.php?t=93910
    3a (Corkicelli), highlighted, fine, low porosity
    SE PA

    HGs: Anything Sevi; Curly Kinks Satin Roots, Curlycue ReNew and Coil Jam; homemade FSG and okra gel; soap bars; UFD Curly Magic; Botanical Spirits Jellies, CJ Repair Me, Aloe Fix
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • coilynappcoilynapp Posts: 4,233Registered Users
    coilynapp wrote: »

    According to HER, she doesn't use it-- but we could all be wrong. Also, once she disturbs the base by changing the consistency with oils and rice milk, SOMETHING has to bring it all back together. So perhaps she's double dipping and that's where the second emulsifier comes in?? Oils falling out of solution and such, it could be why.

    I'm being devious... LOL!!
    If she is using a base, she would not be adding another emulsifier. That would mean heating the base and with a preservative already in it, that will make the preservative not effective anymore.

    IA with Elle. If it was a base, her butters would be at least consistent. When using bases, people don't add an excess of 5% of stuff into it (I think I'm remembering this correctly, don't remember where I read this). You can't do that or you will make everything unstable. In order to add any solids, you would have to heat the base to the melting point of the new solid (e.g., emulsifier) usually 65 C or more, at which point the preservative and all other heat sensitive ingredients in the base, are not effective anymore

    Also, emulsifying wax feels very different from something like ecomulse. E-wax is very waxy-feeling and you would not be getting that smooth, wet like feel with it, as you do with ecomulse. So, no, I don't think she uses e-wax at all. I've used both emulsifiers and I would not be putting e-wax in my hair because it's too waxy for me (every product I've tried that has used e-wax as an emulsifier left my hair feeling waxy and coated--beautiful curls leave in, sheamoisture curl and style milk for example)

    BINGO. Maybe that's why her butters are molding and/or smelling funny and people are complaining about the consistency issue. You've got to admit, when she first started out, i don't recall ANYONE complaining about stuff getting moldy fast or about them seperating. Once she started added more stuff to her butters and changing the ingredients,...that's when the complaints started.
    Maybe, BUT not all her butters are doing this. It's not shea amla ALL the time, nor is it totally twisted ALL the time. It's here and there. If this was the case, NONE of her butters would EVER be emulsified.
    th?id=H.4940802350254088&pid=1.7&w=183&h=144&c=7&rs=1

Leave a Comment

BoldItalicStrikethroughOrdered listUnordered list
Emoji
Image
Align leftAlign centerAlign rightToggle HTML viewToggle full pageToggle lights
Drop image/file