vent!! (advice would be very much appreciated)

curlyaniecurlyanie Posts: 111Registered Users
brace yourself this is going to be a long one...

i'm going crazy over my hair lately, i really don't know where to start...frizz! i can't get rid of it! i thought it needed more moisture, so i got HEHH, but i ended up being OC'd. so then i said, the only thing that's wrong now is that i don't have any curls/ waves, a protein boost could help with that. i used the homemade protein treatment recommended at the livecurlylivefree site: 1st i shampooed, suave coconut then i squeezed out and blotted the excess water. co-washed after an hour with suave coconut condish, rinsed-out with a tiny bit of HEHH then sprayed water and vinegar mixture(for the hard water)..put in about a 'drop' of HEHH as LI then gelled up with a normal hold, water-based gel from Splash (i can't find any of the gels recommended here on NC, this is the most CG gel i've seen)..i thought it would come out bouncy and shiny as my hair usually does when I PT,but nothing much happened:angry7: frizz is still there though admittedly toned down, but the hair is limp,almost straight, no bounce or clumps or anything :cry:
so that's my current condition..

one recurring problem i have is the washing. i used to wash my hair everyday with Pantene,i did condition too but i didn't know i had curly hair or did have any idea how to take care of it. so when i discovered NC.com and realized i did to much washing i tried to change it. But almost always i'd want or have to wash, with 'poo. or else i get white yucky itchy gunk and oily roots that make me look like when i'm sick and didn't shower a few days, even though it's really just 1 day. we do have hard water at home, and i've really tried coping with it through baking soda rinses and ACV rinses, shampoo bars (which i hated! made my hair hard), lemon+conditioner washing...so i gave up on not washing everyday.now i'm 'pooing on 1st day then co-washing the 2nd and 3rd day, but most of the time i alternate co-washing and 'pooing everyday.i'm still trying to get away from the sulfates, but it's really hard to when my head itches..
basically,i just want to spend less time thinking about how my hair looks and wasting money on products. that's just so hard to do when i'm walking down the street and when i take a glance at myself in a shop window and i look horrible!
product staple: suave coconut conditioner
goal: healthy BSL! :D
obstacle: haven't figured it out:crybaby:
:protest:probable suspects
  • hard water
  • varying product use
  • weather-hair chemistry confusion

Comments

  • curlyaniecurlyanie Posts: 111Registered Users
    well THAT felt good...i'm going to start over
    note to self: take it slow and be patient
    product staple: suave coconut conditioner
    goal: healthy BSL! :D
    obstacle: haven't figured it out:crybaby:
    :protest:probable suspects
    • hard water
    • varying product use
    • weather-hair chemistry confusion
  • asianrunnerasianrunner Posts: 2,251Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Sorry that your hair is misbehaving!!! grrr!

    Have you done a brown sugar scrub lately? When I first started going mod-CG my head was super itchy for awhile. Then I discovered brown sugar scrubs which really helped! My scalp was dry but gets oily and itchy after even one day of not showering. But now it's healthy enough where I low poo day one, water wash day two, cowash day three, water wash day four and then start all over.

    What kind of low poo do you use? I use Giovanni TTTT which helps with the itchies as well, and one of my cowashes is the Giovanni TTTT condish.
    Coarse texture, normal-high porosity, normal elasticity (Komaza Care), very weak waves
    cleanser: Redken Fresh Curls Shampoo, CJ Daily Fix

    rinse out: GVP Conditioning Balm, CJ Beauticurls, CJ Smoothing

    jellies/creams: CR Curl Maker, KCCC
    gels: CJ CQ, CJ Pattern Pusha, BRHG

  • finaleofseemfinaleofseem Posts: 900Registered Users
    Suave Naturals doesn't have a lot of protein, if you're truly OC'd. In fact, my hair that likes protein doesn't even register a difference when I try to use it as a PT. It's really more moisturizing than PT on me, and using a rinse out after leaving it on my hair would make me OC'd, too.

    Do you have a Sally's near you? Maybe you could try some of the Ion Reconstructor packets? I personally love love love love the Spiral Solutions Repairing Protein Treatment. It's gentle enough that I don't DT after, just use a rinse out condish. The protein spray has also been a godsend for me and my hair. Kathymack sells samples of the SS line.
    Location: West Virginia (Eastern Panhandle)
    2b/cMii, medium-high porosity

    Likes protein and most oils, HATES mineral oil
    Summer Routine
    Poo: Tresemme Naturals Nourishing Moisture
    Cowash CJ Daily Fix
    Rinse out: Tresemme Naturals Nourishing Moisture
    Leave In: Tresemme Naturals Nourishing Moisture, SSRPT
    Stylers: Ecostyler Krystal, LALSG (in really high dews)
    PT: SS Repairing Protein Treatment
  • rymorg2rymorg2 Posts: 2,571Registered Users
    I'm a stylist...sorry you're struggling.

    OK first of all....you're gonna freak when I tell you this....that white itchy gunky stuff at your scalp you used to get when you used Pantene is FROM the Pantene. Pantene is the WORST for your hair, it's literally nearly 100% water and wax, and not a good wax either, but PARAFIN wax which is CANDLE wax. The gunk was the wax. It's worse with hard water. So I'm thrilled you're not using it anymore.

    Second of all, hello hydration condish isn't CG. If you're trying to be CG, I wouldn't use it. If you're CO washing with it, that's even worse. It has Cyclopentasiloxane in it, as well as Dimethicone. Which means that, even with as little as you used as a LI after the PT you'd still need to use a sulfate or a low poo with something with cocomidapropyl betaine in it to remove it. They build up on the hair. My guess is that the limp, almost straight hair is from the HH. I'd recommend a clarifying shampoo with either a sulfate or a low poo and then some good, CG moisture (your suave would work) to see if it helps.

    FWIW, I have hard water, and I cannot CO wash daily. I have to alternate with low poos. I used to think CO would never work, but then I found Curl Junkie Daily Fix. It's chelating so it removes the mineral deposits from hard water. I still can't use it every day though.
    Cosmetology Educator with sensitivities, eczema and Seborrheic Dermatitis.
    Low poo: looking
    COWash: Eden, cheapo condish, CJDF
    RO: varies
    Protein: CJCF or CJRM
    DT: CJHBDF, CJCR, DBPC
    LI: varies, usually KCKT
    Stylers: KCCC, CRNCM, UFDCM, Curls gel, ecostyler

    Lady Karaan, High Priestess of Hayr Tretements in the Order of Curly Crusaders
    Fotki updated 10/12/10 Password: wavy
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • curlyaniecurlyanie Posts: 111Registered Users
    thank you so much for your replies!!:love1:

    it's so tricky! i actually put an egg mixture in my hair, i just used suave to co-wash it out..
    guilty on the pantene usage, and paraben usage,i stopped using a curl creme with paraben and other bad stuff on it (shiver..) ugh! i was just so desperate, and it gave me curl! but little did i know itch would be the price i would pay!:confused3:
    it's just really frustrating because i can't find much of the stuff that you guys usually use, and purchasing online is really not an option..
    i do have a small "hair spa" pack i bought some time ago here's the ingredients:
    cetrimonium chloride,lactolan,milk protein,glycerine,dimethicone polyol (would this be a problem?) titanium dioxide (sounds scary)

    here's one i've been looking to use as a low poo:
    sodium palmate,sodium palm kernelate,glycerin,cocamidopropyl betaine, disodium cocoyl glutamate,chamomile recutita, sodium lactate, cocos nucifera, prunus amygdalus dulcis,fragrance,DMDM hydantoin,panthenol, citric acid,poloquaternium 7, tocopheryl acetate,BHT, tetrasodium EDTA, tetrasodium etidronate, CI#77891
    i'd love to have that CJ low poo, i've been 'hearing' so many good reviews about it but there are no CJ stuff here, or SS for that matter..i wish a Sally's would be put up here soon so i could at least find some of the products you mention!lately my poo would be suave which had ammonium laureth sulfate if i'm not mistaken..

    one other question though:
    rymorg, what's your wash routine?i'm curious how you got your hair to look like THAT! with hard water even!
    would you consider taking me under your curly hair "wing":notworthy: hahaha:toothy9:
    product staple: suave coconut conditioner
    goal: healthy BSL! :D
    obstacle: haven't figured it out:crybaby:
    :protest:probable suspects
    • hard water
    • varying product use
    • weather-hair chemistry confusion
  • curlyaniecurlyanie Posts: 111Registered Users
    going to rummage the shelves for brown sugar now...
    i'm off to wash!!:nike:
    product staple: suave coconut conditioner
    goal: healthy BSL! :D
    obstacle: haven't figured it out:crybaby:
    :protest:probable suspects
    • hard water
    • varying product use
    • weather-hair chemistry confusion
  • MyrnaMyrna Posts: 2,471Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    Curlyanie, I feel your pain. Its been a very difficult summer for hair. I thought I had my routine down, and then this summer happened.

    I have 2C/3A hair, which means I can scrunch curl into it, and its cut in long layers. It also means that if I washed and did nothing with it, I would look like Medusa. It also means that a good stylist could get it stick straight which I have not done since I was a girl and that was longer ago than I care to recall.

    Basic recs: Start by using a mild shampoo and conditioner. Do you have color treated hair? I do, and I like one of L'Oreal's shampoos for color treated hair. in this humidity, I find that a lighter conditioner works best for me, and lighter conditioners do in general.

    I cant use a lot of the products and methods that other curlies use here, you know, the stuff that the 3B's and C's use. They want to loosen their curls; I want to have more of mine. So I dont "plop", and I dont apply products to soaking wet hair, I actually keep in in a microwave towel for about 10 min. Then I apply a light mousse. Then recently I have been using an aloe vera gel, which is cheap and good; and I mix that with just a bit of regular gel. This seems to work pretty well for now. But this is a bad hair summer. Keep reading. You will find a routine and products that work.
  • plunkybugplunkybug Posts: 2,526Registered Users
    Suave Naturals doesn't have a lot of protein, if you're truly OC'd. In fact, my hair that likes protein doesn't even register a difference when I try to use it as a PT.

    Ditto.


    Lady Caiside, Noble Lushetarian and Wavy Wayfarer of Mugglswick, in the Order of the Curly Crusaders

    2b-3a Fii, porous and low elasticity

    Currently using a variety of products, and looking for that magic combo

    Hair bio: http://www.naturallycurly.com/curltalk/showpost.php?p=1252125&postcount=59

  • rymorg2rymorg2 Posts: 2,571Registered Users
    curlyanie wrote: »
    thank you so much for your replies!!:love1:

    it's so tricky! i actually put an egg mixture in my hair, i just used suave to co-wash it out..
    guilty on the pantene usage, and paraben usage,i stopped using a curl creme with paraben and other bad stuff on it (shiver..) ugh! i was just so desperate, and it gave me curl! but little did i know itch would be the price i would pay!:confused3:
    it's just really frustrating because i can't find much of the stuff that you guys usually use, and purchasing online is really not an option..
    i do have a small "hair spa" pack i bought some time ago here's the ingredients:
    cetrimonium chloride,lactolan,milk protein,glycerine,dimethicone polyol (would this be a problem?) titanium dioxide (sounds scary)

    here's one i've been looking to use as a low poo:
    sodium palmate,sodium palm kernelate,glycerin,cocamidopropyl betaine, disodium cocoyl glutamate,chamomile recutita, sodium lactate, cocos nucifera, prunus amygdalus dulcis,fragrance,DMDM hydantoin,panthenol, citric acid,poloquaternium 7, tocopheryl acetate,BHT, tetrasodium EDTA, tetrasodium etidronate, CI#77891
    i'd love to have that CJ low poo, i've been 'hearing' so many good reviews about it but there are no CJ stuff here, or SS for that matter..i wish a Sally's would be put up here soon so i could at least find some of the products you mention!lately my poo would be suave which had ammonium laureth sulfate if i'm not mistaken..

    one other question though:
    rymorg, what's your wash routine?i'm curious how you got your hair to look like THAT! with hard water even!
    would you consider taking me under your curly hair "wing":notworthy: hahaha:toothy9:


    I do believe that the dimethicone copolyol in the spa pack is water soluable...but that said, my hair doesn't like any cones, other than one PEG modified one for some reason. It relaxes my wurl.

    The low poo looks fine to me.

    Awwww, of course I will! My typical routine is always changing though. LOL....

    Usually I'll go by the feel and look of my hair. Some days I skip washing, some days I even skip wetting! But most days I rotate between a low poo and a cleansing conditioner like my daily fix from CJ. My hair likes rotation, so I rotate conditioners too, as well as styling products.

    Usually I do my PT and DT on the weekends....actually I do them two days in a row but most people won't need to do that.

    So a typical day is:

    1. Wash with a low poo or Cleansing conditioner as soon as I get in the shower
    2. Condition with one of my conditioners in rotation (most of them have some protein in them) leaving it in while I finish my shower, then rinsing
    3. In the shower after rinsing, apply my hair products to wet hair. Sometimes I squeeze some water out, sometimes not. Usually I'll do an enhancer that also has moisturizing properties in it so that it'll be both LI and enhancer for me, followed with something for hold.
    4. Get out, scrunch with curls like us towel, sometimes plop for no more than 10 mins, then clippie and air dry awhile
    5. Diffuse the rest of the way and SOTC.

    HTH!
    Cosmetology Educator with sensitivities, eczema and Seborrheic Dermatitis.
    Low poo: looking
    COWash: Eden, cheapo condish, CJDF
    RO: varies
    Protein: CJCF or CJRM
    DT: CJHBDF, CJCR, DBPC
    LI: varies, usually KCKT
    Stylers: KCCC, CRNCM, UFDCM, Curls gel, ecostyler

    Lady Karaan, High Priestess of Hayr Tretements in the Order of Curly Crusaders
    Fotki updated 10/12/10 Password: wavy
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • curlyaniecurlyanie Posts: 111Registered Users
    thanks myrna! i have never colored my hair but it's something i would consider when i do get a color treatment

    it does help rymorg:idea1:i'll have to consider the rotation of conditioners plus weekly treatments!

    update on my hair, it's still kind of limp so ponytail day for me...i used the spa pack,and i guess it did something because the front pieces of my hair went boing again and spirally even..i bought a filter,it has activated carbon. i hope it would help with the hard water, i just water washed today, and the scalp feels fine..
    here are pics!
    ry%3D400
    ry%3D400
    it held up pretty ok, but I do wish it looked like this all day. I think I should have a diff. approach for the rest of my hair,these are only the wurliest/curliest bits
    product staple: suave coconut conditioner
    goal: healthy BSL! :D
    obstacle: haven't figured it out:crybaby:
    :protest:probable suspects
    • hard water
    • varying product use
    • weather-hair chemistry confusion
  • plunkybugplunkybug Posts: 2,526Registered Users
    The front looks really cute! I love the spirals there. Even in a ponytail it looks good, and you know, it is summer, so ponytails are totally ok. :thumbright:


    Lady Caiside, Noble Lushetarian and Wavy Wayfarer of Mugglswick, in the Order of the Curly Crusaders

    2b-3a Fii, porous and low elasticity

    Currently using a variety of products, and looking for that magic combo

    Hair bio: http://www.naturallycurly.com/curltalk/showpost.php?p=1252125&postcount=59

  • MyrnaMyrna Posts: 2,471Registered Users Curl Connoisseur
    Regarding hard water: use an apple cider vinegar rinse. Perfect for that.

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