OT: Jill Scott's comment on Interacial dating

curlykinky21curlykinky21 Posts: 112Registered Users Curl Neophyte
I know this is off topic, but I was just reading this post on The YBF about Jill Scott's column in Essence Mag about black men dating white women and thought it was pretty thought provoking. Your thoughts?

http://theybf.com/index.php/2010/03/27/jill-scott-gets-to-the-bottom-of-the-interracial-sting/
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  • msbigfinefromsbigfinefro Posts: 69Registered Users
    i thought it was well writen, she was not downing anyone, yet explaining "the sting" that black women or people sometimes feel. It is true on my end and i have interacially dated. I have a close friend who has a child with a white man and his engaged to him. It's true that black men have more options, black men are looked at as sexy, black women, well we have to fit a "mold" in mass media to be looked at as sexy. Hopefully things will change, but honestly this is the way of world i feel. if it wasnt it still wouldnt be a topic.
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  • maybejadeymaybejadey Posts: 198Registered Users
    I personally don't much see how it matters. If an African-American man chooses to be with a Caucasian woman BECAUSE she is Caucasian, he's clearly not very self-aware. I wouldn't want him chasing after/distracting me; I'm simply not attracted to someone who cannot think for themselves.

    I am very for interracial dating if that is who you are attracted to, physically or personality wise. Now, any sane person would hope that in addition to a physical attraction, there is some mental chemistry, otherwise a person is just chasing a falling star.

    I think there is a deeper problem tied up in the Black men dating White women concern. That is, that many (not all, thankfully) men value women by their appearance as measured by the media's benchmark, whether it's Essence or Vogue, MTV or BET. I think without the constant white noise from these channels, we're all attracted to different looks/personalities that are probably in our personal best biological interest. I speak as a little brown girl whose always had a special attraction for handsome Asian men.

    I'm not saying African-American women should get over it. Just that you probably didn't want that guy if the reasons behind his choice were so shallow. The bite is in the media/social stereotype that African-American women aren't desirable. And in that case, the best we can do is go out, be sexy, be smart, be successful, be responsible, and all those wonderful things we are, and put ourselves out there to be desired by the right man (or woman!) for us, no matter their race.
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  • NinjaretteNinjarette Posts: 3,982Registered Users
    Couple of things:

    We all must take responsibility for our reproductivity. If a woman desires to have a husband, then a family, then she must live her life accordingly, and stand her ground. Yes, husbands leave their wives, but it seems "baby daddies" have a swifter rate of departure. Now, if you don't want the traditional family, then...do you. But we all should know how it works, by now.

    If some black men want to date white women exclusively, then that's perfectly okay with me. But let it end there. Don't make it about black women lacking something vs white women, who seemingly lack nothing. A lot of brothers just prefer the white aesthetic, and they've embraced some "white women stereotypes', and wanna use those stereotypes to justify their preferences. I have no respect for, nor any desire to be with those kind of men. Man up and love the woman who brings something to your life, for whatever reason. I don't have to approve.
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  • curlyhersheygirlcurlyhersheygirl Posts: 475Registered Users
    I agree with Nea.
    If you find love with someone outside your race I have no issue with that but the problem arises when you want to say that black women (or men ) are flawed that's why you don't date them.
  • curlykinky21curlykinky21 Posts: 112Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    I agree with Nea.
    If you find love with someone outside your race I have no issue with that but the problem arises when you want to say that black women (or men ) are flawed that's why you don't date them.

    YES! This is what boils me up! I have heard young boys even say that they won't date black women when they get older because black women have attitude problems, etc. I'm like "You're 16 what do you know?" All they are doing is repeating what they have heard and the fact they are hearing such things is a problem in itself. If you happen to fall in love with a person from a different racial makeup, fine, more power to you. However, if you oust an entire race of women based on superficial reasons, I have a huge problem with that and I do think that there is something deeper in the psyche of these types of men that is the cause of this....
  • Cali ChikCali Chik Posts: 1,494Registered Users
    I thought she wrote a pretty good article. I understand exactly what she means.

    I will say this tho, I've come to a place where I had to learn not to take things like this personally. I think so many of us take it personally which is why we feel "betrayed" in a sense.

    But like I said, we have to not take things so personally.... even if someone feels the need to justify their relationship with a white person by saying ppl of their own ethnic background are *insert negative remark.* Because at the end of the day, it's not about you at all. It's about them and their issues and their own personal pain.
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  • jeweldjeweld Posts: 140Registered Users
    Cali Chik wrote: »
    I thought she wrote a pretty good article. I understand exactly what she means.

    I will say this tho, I've come to a place where I had to learn not to take things like this personally. I think so many of us take it personally which is why we feel "betrayed" in a sense.

    But like I said, we have to not take things so personally.... even if someone feels the need to justify their relationship with a white person by saying ppl of their own ethnic background are *insert negative remark.* Because at the end of the day, it's not about you at all. It's about them and their issues and their own personal pain.

    ITA Cali

    I struggled with not feeling that "sting" while working around successful, handsome, black men who exclusively wore white women on their arms. When this discussion came up they would defend their relationships, not with love for their SO but with stereotypes and ignorance of how black women are.
    I realized there is no way in hell I would date these weak, slaves to society.

    Funny thing is, this discussion arose from them seeing me with my white bf. It was as if whitey made me dateable to them. :cwm10:
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  • subbrocksubbrock Posts: 8,212Registered Users
    i agree with pretty much everything everyone has already said. i wonder if jill's comments and feelings have anything to do with a lack of fulfilment in her own love life (failed marriage and a failed relationship with her baby daddy). i know when im happy and secure with my relationship, i dont even notice who anybody else is with.
  • Cali ChikCali Chik Posts: 1,494Registered Users
    jeweld wrote: »
    Cali Chik wrote: »
    I thought she wrote a pretty good article. I understand exactly what she means.

    I will say this tho, I've come to a place where I had to learn not to take things like this personally. I think so many of us take it personally which is why we feel "betrayed" in a sense.

    But like I said, we have to not take things so personally.... even if someone feels the need to justify their relationship with a white person by saying ppl of their own ethnic background are *insert negative remark.* Because at the end of the day, it's not about you at all. It's about them and their issues and their own personal pain.

    ITA Cali

    I struggled with not feeling that "sting" while working around successful, handsome, black men who exclusively wore white women on their arms. When this discussion came up they would defend their relationships, not with love for their SO but with stereotypes and ignorance of how black women are.
    I realized there is no way in hell I would date these weak, slaves to society.

    Funny thing is, this discussion arised from them seeing me with my white bf. It was as if whitey made me dateable to them. :cwm10:
    and you would think a woman (regardless of race) would be offended that someone was with you because of some stereotypical image they have of you and people like you. I have a homegirl who is Mexican that is currently dating a black guy and she asked him if he dated black girls. She said that if he had said "no" she wouldn't date him anymore. But my friend is also hella politically and socially minded.

    The other thing I hear is that "black women are too strong" if I were with a man like that and I wasn't black I'd be like "So you are with me because you think I'm weak?"
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  • EllyEllyOxenFreeEllyEllyOxenFree Posts: 6,446Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Hmmm...I have mixed feelings about what she said. I can see why she would feel that way, but at the same time, I don't think it's a productive way of thinking if we are to move forward as a society. Taking the past into consideration in choosing a mate is kind of silly to me. However - I can see what she means when she talks about black men and women struggling together. I personally have dated White men, but no longer do - not because they are White, but because I have found that they don't understand (or try to understand) specific concerns of Black people. If I am upset about something someone said/did to me because I feel it was based on race, I don't need my man to look at me blankly and say, "Babe, I don't know why you are so upset..." And believe me, for me to feel that way it takes a LOT; I am definitely not militant in any way. It's a lack of awareness/understanding that I've witnessed.

    Now, that is based on MY experience (and trust me, I have dated many White men), but if I met someone who I thought was different, I'd most likely give him a chance. And because that was my experience, I am not going to knock anyone for dating/loving/marrying whoever.

    What J. Scott said was very well written and she was not trying to bash anyone, and I definitely don't think what she wrote means she is insecure or is hurt that she hasn't found a man.

    Does anyone know why she wrote this? Was it in response to something?
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  • CocoTCocoT Posts: 5,330Registered Users
    I don't think a lot of people actually think about why they date a particular race. At least from what I have seen, its just about trends nowadays it seems. Do you exclusively date black men? Why do you exclusively date black men? (assuming that most of the people reading this are black- no offense).
    We are not obligated to date inside our own race, so why do you do it? I've never been in a real romantic relationship at all so its not like I am speaking from experience but instead of getting offended over some knucklehead black men that don't date black women for bulls*** reasons then why not expand your horizons? This can go both ways you know. I'm sure there are black men offended by black women dating other races.
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  • one sweet hair divaone sweet hair diva Posts: 7Registered Users
    CocoT wrote: »
    I don't think a lot of people actually think about why they date a particular race. At least from what I have seen, its just about trends nowadays it seems. Do you exclusively date black men? Why do you exclusively date black men? (assuming that most of the people reading this are black- no offense).
    We are not obligated to date inside our own race, so why do you do it? I've never been in a real romantic relationship at all so its not like I am speaking from experience but instead of getting offended over some knucklehead black men that don't date black women for bulls*** reasons then why not expand your horizons? This can go both ways you know. I'm sure there are black men offended by black women dating other races.
    I don't have a lot of experience with dating outside my race. But from what I've heard its not like dating outsude your race is giving you a better chance at love. I have a co-worker who like me is apart of the small single group everyone at work looks at funny. She has told me that she deosn't think she would have anything in common with a black man, and I kind of feel the same thing about white men. If or when I do find that person I will try him out. BUT she agreed that its just as bad for her. She is not a very thin white female but she has a shape most brothers would really respond to, however, she is often looked past by her male counterparts because of her size. So I believe it has alot to do with that many before have said, this Media focused addiciton on what beauty and attraction should and should not be. It really doesn't help it when the media paints Blk Women to be strong, loud, mothering,and needy.
  • EllyEllyOxenFreeEllyEllyOxenFree Posts: 6,446Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    I have a question...would you be offended if you were a White woman and a Black man was dating you b/c of your image in the media? Like, "Here's my pretty White woman, look at her!"

    Just asking because on the other hand, I get offended when White men see Black women as "exotic" and say things like, "Oh, I love your skin tone..." I am not your little Redbone trophy. Next!
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  • 3c4d7zwhatevs3c4d7zwhatevs Posts: 1,589Registered Users
    ellepixie wrote: »
    I have a question...would you be offended if you were a White woman and a Black man was dating you b/c of your image in the media? Like, "Here's my pretty White woman, look at her!"

    Just asking because on the other hand, I get offended when White men see Black women as "exotic" and say things like, "Oh, I love your skin tone..." I am not your little Redbone trophy. Next!
    Damn, you broke out the REDBONE lol Maybe I am out of it but do we still classify ourselves that way? The redbones, high-yellows and (I honestly have no idea of what my category is, because people were always extolling the virtues of the two previous one when I was a kid)
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  • EllyEllyOxenFreeEllyEllyOxenFree Posts: 6,446Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    sagehen wrote: »
    ellepixie wrote: »
    I have a question...would you be offended if you were a White woman and a Black man was dating you b/c of your image in the media? Like, "Here's my pretty White woman, look at her!"

    Just asking because on the other hand, I get offended when White men see Black women as "exotic" and say things like, "Oh, I love your skin tone..." I am not your little Redbone trophy. Next!
    Damn, you broke out the REDBONE lol Maybe I am out of it but do we still classify ourselves that way? The redbones, high-yellows and (I honestly have no idea of what my category is, because people were always extolling the virtues of the two previous one when I was a kid)

    Hah! I was playing with that ref, I don't classify myself as any of that mess...but that's what a lot of Black men call me. SMH. All tomfoolery to me!
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  • SystemSystem Posts: 39,060 Administrator
    I was trying not to respond to this thread but I kept thinking about it so here it goes. Jill expressed in her article that she feels a "tinge" or whatever she called it when she sees black men and white women in this country and NOT when she is in Europe. Her reasoning being the effects of slavery and racism in America that we still carry with us. This has caused such a divide between black men and women. We as black women more so than black men carry our ancestors behind us. They are chained to us. We remember, deep inside us, what it feels like to degraded by the main stream society. We are constantly reminded by the media that we are not enough. And in many parts of world, we are the most hated group of women. We are raped in the Congo. Beaten and denied education in many parts of the world. To see a black man with a white woman, sometimes makes our ancestors scream inside us. That's what that pesty feeling is.

    I'm not saying that interracial relationships are wrong. I think today it is more accepted, especially by the younger generation. But I am 51 years old. I remember when King was shot, riots in the streets, Black is beautiful, Say it loud, I'm black and I'm proud. Beautiful black women with big afros walking prooudly. Back then black men and women fought together, starved together, protested together and sometimes died together. And when I see a black man with his very white mate, my ancestors scream and I have to take a deep breath and tell myself, it's not me...I'm OK. Times have just changed and love is love..etc, etc. etc.
  • *Marah**Marah* Posts: 8,032Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    I might get ripped a new one from some of you ladies for saying this.. but when has that ever stopped me.

    I read the article.. I couldn't access the link for some reason so I had to search it down.. found it.. read it. Anyway.... I like Jill Scott's music. Always have.. but I've never liked her attitude. It's something about her that just never set well with me at all.

    Reading this article just confirmed. This is just my view but TO ME she comes off bitter as hell and she has been for a while now. And frankly, I don't see it as any of her business who a black man or anyone else dates. I think her focus should be more reflected on her own failed relationships and raising her own child. Instead of worrying about who this new black male friend of hers is married to. I do think her own failed love life has added to this bitterness. I can recall reading comments she made about her life regarding the divorce and even then she seemed bitter.

    I do understand the sentiment from certain black women about black men marrying a white woman when they reach a certain financial and/or educational status but at the end of the day..it's their choice. Sure, I can certainly see the annoyance when it looks as if the guy is with the white woman simply because she's white. Sort of using her as a way of saying, "Look at me.. I got a white woman". Like a status symbol. I think that's wrong no matter who does it. I don't like it when rich dudes (regardless of race) do it with younger women that they know damn well wouldn't have them if they weren't swimming in money. The reality is people do it.. and it should have no reflection on how one feels about themself nor should it make them feel "betrayed" unless of course the black man left you high and dry for her. Then.. you may have a legit beef in my view.

    But on the same token, I feel like certain people need to get over this dating people inside your race BS. If that's your personal preference, fine. Then YOU date in your race. But don't act like if someone does it..that it's your business or like you have a right to judge them about it or catch an attitude about it. Because 9 times out of 10, they aren't with that white woman simply to make a black woman "wince". So her idea of "betrayal" seems unwarranted and overkill.

    I honestly felt like Jill's essay only adds to the sterotype that black women are bitter, petty, insecure, and jealous. That sort of bugs me because there are PLENTY of black women that could give less than a damn about who a black man dates. They aren't thinking about him or his white woman. They are about business and above Tom Foolery. So I have to say.. I was way less than thrilled with her article and I can see why it has sparked controversy.

    Besides that Jill wasn't no damn slave so I didn't get the whole bringing up massa and what not. It urks me when people use that as an excuse to justify some **** they are promoting. If Jill is insecure because a new friend is married to a white woman.. then Jill needs to get Jill's mind right and stop being all in this man's business.

    She said the man is intelligent, handsome, financially well off. So if he has all these qualities then clearly he's capable of making the choice that HE wants to make in a suitable mate for himself. I would simply be glad he found a mate that that apparently makes him happy..whatever her race is. I don't understand why it hurts her if he's not married to a "sister". Um..it wasn't as if the man was available and picked a white woman over Jill. So I don't get why she's so pre-occupied with the race of that man's wife.

    At LEAST the man was in a committed relationship and not dropping baby here and baby there not taking care of his responsibilities. That is what I would be MORE upset with..if the man was a giga-ho running from woman to woman (regardless of race).

    On a side note: I noticed she put out that she was raised JW. I wonder is she aware of the sordid history that the JW organization has with racism against blacks. Given, I wouldn't expect it. It's a rare case a black person in that denomenation do know about it.

    If you all don't like what I said.. I understand. But I think most of you know by now.. I call it like I see it. :evil1:
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  • subbrocksubbrock Posts: 8,212Registered Users
    I was trying not to respond to this thread but I kept thinking about it so here it goes. Jill expressed in her article that she feels a "tinge" or whatever she called it when she sees black men and white women in this country and NOT when she is in Europe. Her reasoning being the effects of slavery and racism in America that we still carry with us. This has caused such a divide between black men and women. We as black women more so than black men carry our ancestors behind us. They are chained to us. We remember, deep inside us, what it feels like to degraded by the main stream society. We are constantly reminded by the media that we are not enough. And in many parts of world, we are the most hated group of women. We are raped in the Congo. Beaten and denied education in many parts of the world. To see a black man with a white woman, sometimes makes our ancestors scream inside us. That's what that pesty feeling is.

    I'm not saying that interracial relationships are wrong. I think today it is more accepted, especially by the younger generation. But I am 51 years old. I remember when King was shot, riots in the streets, Black is beautiful, Say it loud, I'm black and I'm proud. Beautiful black women with big afros walking prooudly. Back then black men and women fought together, starved together, protested together and sometimes died together. And when I see a black man with his very white mate, my ancestors scream and I have to take a deep breath and tell myself, it's not me...I'm OK. Times have just changed and love is love..etc, etc. etc.

    this part stood out to me because i have the exact opposite reaction. my dad is going to be 60 this year and he's told me his experiences living through the civil rights movement. he remembers when schools became desegregated, he remembers when the nationla guard stormed his HBCU. we (my parents and my family) live in greensboro, nc where the historical woolworth's lunch counter sit in occured and where the greensboro massacre took place. my family tree is full of people who lost everything because they chose to love someone who was black. and when i take a step back and look at my SO or my child, i think this is what it was all for. this is what all the fighting was for. they went through that so that we didnt have to. love is love, just like its always been--that hasnt changed with time.
  • cole12cole12 Posts: 59Registered Users
    I might get ripped a new one from some of you ladies for saying this.. but when has that ever stopped me.

    I read the article.. I couldn't access the link for some reason so I had to search it down.. found it.. read it. Anyway.... I like Jill Scott's music. Always have.. but I've never liked her attitude. It's something about her that just never set well with me at all.

    Reading this article just confirmed. This is just my view but TO ME she comes off bitter as hell and she has been for a while now. And frankly, I don't see it as any of her business who a black man or anyone else dates. I think her focus should be more reflected on her own failed relationships and raising her own child. Instead of worrying about who this new black male friend of hers is married to. I do think her own failed love life has added to this bitterness. I can recall reading comments she made about her life regarding the divorce and even then she seemed bitter.

    I do understand the sentiment from certain black women about black men marrying a white woman when they reach a certain financial and/or educational status but at the end of the day..it's their choice. Sure, I can certainly see the annoyance when it looks as if the guy is with the white woman simply because she's white. Sort of using her as a way of saying, "Look at me.. I got a white woman". Like a status symbol. I think that's wrong no matter who does it. I don't like it when rich dudes (regardless of race) do it with younger women that they know damn well wouldn't have them if they weren't swimming in money. The reality is people do it.. and it should have no reflection on how one feels about themself nor should it make them feel "betrayed" unless of course the black man left you high and dry for her. Then.. you may have a legit beef in my view.

    But on the same token, I feel like certain people need to get over this dating people inside your race BS. If that's your personal preference, fine. Then YOU date in your race. But don't act like if someone does it..that it's your business or like you have a right to judge them about it or catch an attitude about it. Because 9 times out of 10, they aren't with that white woman simply to make a black woman "wince". So her idea of "betrayal" seems unwarranted and overkill.

    I honestly felt like Jill's essay only adds to the sterotype that black women are bitter, petty, insecure, and jealous. That sort of bugs me because there are PLENTY of black women that could give less than a damn about who a black man dates. They aren't thinking about him or his white woman. They are about business and above Tom Foolery. So I have to say.. I was way less than thrilled with her article and I can see why it has sparked controversy.

    Besides that Jill wasn't no damn slave so I didn't get the whole bringing up massa and what not. It urks me when people use that as an excuse to justify some **** they are promoting. If Jill is insecure because a new friend is married to a white woman.. then Jill needs to get Jill's mind right and stop being all in this man's business.

    She said the man is intelligent, handsome, financially well off. So if he has all these qualities then clearly he's capable of making the choice that HE wants to make in a suitable mate for himself. I would simply be glad he found a mate that that apparently makes him happy..whatever her race is. I don't understand why it hurts her if he's not married to a "sister". Um..it wasn't as if the man was available and picked a white woman over Jill. So I don't get why she's so pre-occupied with the race of that man's wife.

    At LEAST the man was in a committed relationship and not dropping baby here and baby there not taking care of his responsibilities. That is what I would be MORE upset with..if the man was a giga-ho running from woman to woman (regardless of race).

    On a side note: I noticed she put out that she was raised JW. I wonder is she aware of the sorted history that the JW organization has with racism against blacks. Given, I wouldn't expect it. It's a rare case a black person in that denomenation do know about it.

    If you all don't like what I said.. I understand. But I think most of you know by now.. I call it like I see it. :evil1:

    I agree. It irritates the hell out of me when a person tries to actively discourage interracial dating by claiming betrayal. In most cases they don't even know the person they are feeling betrayed by and there is a very good chance the person doing the "betraying" doesn't give a sh*t what they think.

    Also when people are so wrapped up in only dating within their race I feel that reflects poorly more so on them then anything else. Like you said, preferences are all good and well but if you are purposefully limiting yourself (and attempting to limit others) based on the race of a potential SO; you are doing yourself more of a disservice than anyone else.

    With regards to my personal feelings about interracial dating. I have never felt this betrayal or felt that I was obligated to date within my race or that members of my race are obligated to date chicks that "look like me." This is probably why me and my brother both have been dubbed the ones "most likely to mix" in our family. That in itself seems to be another issue which I could rant about from now until the end of time.
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  • Bookworm08Bookworm08 Posts: 42Registered Users
    I actually read Jill Scott's article when it was on Essence.com and I remember thinking as I read her article that maybe she had something against interracial relationships. But then I reread the article and i think the sting that she is talking about is when a black man reaches a certain status that he trades in a black woman for a white woman.I think she brings up slavery because white woman were seen as more desirable then and it is reflected in today's society.
    Now I don't care what race a black man chooses to date but I do have a problem when black men try to put down black women in order to justify dating outside their race. You should not feel the need to justify your relationship to anyone if your relationship is soley based on love. Love transcends race ...
  • maybejadeymaybejadey Posts: 198Registered Users
    cole12 wrote: »
    Also when people are so wrapped up in only dating within their race I feel that reflects poorly more so on them then anything else. Like you said, preferences are all good and well but if you are purposefully limiting yourself (and attempting to limit others) based on the race of a potential SO; you are doing yourself more of a disservice than anyone else.

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  • *Marah**Marah* Posts: 8,032Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    Bookworm08 wrote: »
    I actually read Jill Scott's article when it was on Essence.com and I remember thinking as I read her article that maybe she had something against interracial relationships. But then I reread the article and i think the sting that she is talking about is when a black man reaches a certain status that he trades in a black woman for a white woman.

    The only thing is she DIDN'T say that in the article. She didn't say anything about black man trading in a black women for a white woman.. if she said that.. then I wouldn't have any issue with her article at all. Because that is jacked up.

    But I didn't see she said anything even remotely close to that...

    I mean is this the article you read ?
    http://www.essence.com/relationships/commentary_3/commentary_jill_scott_talks_interracial.php

    Because the link the OP posted didn't work for me so I had to search it out. Is that the article everyone was reading ? Because if so.. I didn't see her saying anything about being upset about a black man trading in a black woman for a white one.

    What I noticed is that she cited "betrayal" by a black man being with a white woman period.

    Here is a quote from her in that article
    These harsh truths lead to what we really feel when we see a seemingly together brother with a Caucasian woman and their children. That feeling is betrayed. While we exert efforts to raise our sons and daughters to appreciate themselves and respect others, most of us end up doing this important work alone, with no fathers or like representatives, limited financial support (often court-enforced) and, on top of everything else, an empty bed. It's frustrating and it hurts!

    Sounds to me like she's more ticked off that she sees black women as being single mothers, black men as being absentee fathers, black women not having a lot of money but can get child support which is mininmal, and a black woman not having a man to sleep with...while I guess the white woman doesn't face these sorts of things..because she's got the white man.. and now the black man too.

    All that seems like it bitterness to me. And I can see a black man pointing that out but then he would get labeled as putting a "sister" or "sisters" down by certain folks.
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  • breathebreathe Posts: 399Registered Users
    Nea wrote: »
    Couple of things:

    We all must take responsibility for our reproductivity. If a woman desires to have a husband, then a family, then she must live her life accordingly, and stand her ground. Yes, husbands leave their wives, but it seems "baby daddies" have a swifter rate of departure. Now, if you don't want the traditional family, then...do you. But we all should know how it works, by now.

    i agree. i wish more people could understand this.
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  • EllyEllyOxenFreeEllyEllyOxenFree Posts: 6,446Registered Users Curl Neophyte
    I wonder what her thoughts are on a Black woman with a White man? Is that supposed to be better? Like I said, I can see why she would feel that way, but she should at least be consistent in her thought process...
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  • NinjaretteNinjarette Posts: 3,982Registered Users
    cole12 wrote: »
    Also when people are so wrapped up in only dating within their race I feel that reflects poorly more so on them then anything else. Like you said, preferences are all good and well but if you are purposefully limiting yourself (and attempting to limit others) based on the race of a potential SO; you are doing yourself more of a disservice than anyone else.

    With regards to my personal feelings about interracial dating. I have never felt this betrayal or felt that I was obligated to date within my race or that members of my race are obligated to date chicks that "look like me." This is probably why me and my brother both have been dubbed the ones "most likely to mix" in our family. That in itself seems to be another issue which I could rant about from now until the end of time.

    But see, there are some black women who don't find white men, or asian men, or whatever men attractive, physically (I'm not one). That's just the way it is. That's perfectly okay.

    What gets me is when black women seem okay with taking on the "martyr" role, which is a willingness to sacrifice true love and a family, because they feel the burden of "preserving the black family". Why must that burden rest on black women? That's pure foolishness.
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  • cheveuxboucléscheveuxbouclés Posts: 1,111Registered Users
    I read the article in the magazine and understood what she is trying to say. I don't think she is bitter and I kind of resent this attitude that black women cannot express their feelings and thoughts about IR without coming off resentful.

    I don't have a problem with loving who you want to love--just with the notion that some black men "can't put up with black women". These are the same men who were raised by ( often single,struggling) women, but then they grow-up and say they all have attitudes and they don't want to stand by their men. I won't go into my theory about black mothers enabling their sons, thus leading to these attitudes... I also find it funny that some black men get even more indignent than black women when the roles are reversed. Jill could be talking from a place of hurt or she could be speaking on the truth as she sees it.
  • HoneysmokeHoneysmoke Posts: 60Registered Users
    Full disclosure: I have been married to a white man for 9 years, and we have two little girls, 5 and almost 3.

    I can't help but think this article came out to support what Essence editors think many of their readers think -- that Reggie Bush should not have been on the cover of the February issue.

    I think they rushed this piece into the April issue so that they can show their readers that they get it.

    What's interesting to me is that Jill Scott hasn't taken up any other issues about race, so why take up this one? And as one person above said, why only black men with white women? Does she not wince when she sees sisters like me with white men?

    I fell in love with who I fell in love with. Why does that have anything to do with anyone outside of our relationship? I, for one, am glad we live in a place where people can do just that. Now if black men "wince" when they see me with my loving husband, that is on them. By the same token, if Jill Scott winces when she sees a black man with a white woman, that is on her.

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  • Cali ChikCali Chik Posts: 1,494Registered Users
    ellepixie wrote: »
    I wonder what her thoughts are on a Black woman with a White man? Is that supposed to be better? Like I said, I can see why she would feel that way, but she should at least be consistent in her thought process...
    But I don't think that even reflects what she's talking about. That question would only make sense if you were talking to a black male.

    The message I got from the article she wrote was how she came to understand the feelings that she was having about seeing black men with white women. I thought she pretty much hit the nail on the head by basically saying that she felt a sense of betrayal. I think that's how a lot of black women feel (especially older ones) in regards to black men dating white women. I totally get where she's coming from. I don't have those feelings now. Like I said before, I've come to a place where I don't take that sh*t personally. If they are doing it for love or if they are doing it because they hate black women... either way, their decision aint got jack squat to do with me.
    subbrock wrote: »
    - don't let everybody elses long straight weave bum you out. don't let other people's big/long natural hair bum you out either. embrace what you have and rock it with confidence, because that's the only way you'll be happy. and whether you realize it or not you are somebody's influence. show them what it truly means to be confident.

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  • Cali ChikCali Chik Posts: 1,494Registered Users
    Honeysmoke wrote: »
    Full disclosure: I have been married to a white man for 9 years, and we have two little girls, 5 and almost 3.

    I can't help but think this article came out to support what Essence editors think many of their readers think -- that Reggie Bush should not have been on the cover of the February issue.

    I think they rushed this piece into the April issue so that they can show their readers that they get it.

    What's interesting to me is that Jill Scott hasn't taken up any other issues about race, so why take up this one? And as one person above said, why only black men with white women? Does she not wince when she sees sisters like me with white men?

    I fell in love with who I fell in love with. Why does that have anything to do with anyone outside of our relationship? I, for one, am glad we live in a place where people can do just that. Now if black men "wince" when they see me with my loving husband, that is on them. By the same token, if Jill Scott winces when she sees a black man with a white woman, that is on her.

    Honeysmoke
    www.honeysmoke.com
    But I don't think Jill Scott was attacking interracial dating or marriages at all. I think she was just saying that she finally realized what the feeling was that she was feeling. I don't see it as "Taking up a racial issue" at all.
    subbrock wrote: »
    - don't let everybody elses long straight weave bum you out. don't let other people's big/long natural hair bum you out either. embrace what you have and rock it with confidence, because that's the only way you'll be happy. and whether you realize it or not you are somebody's influence. show them what it truly means to be confident.

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  • h2wQueenh2wQueen Posts: 551Registered Users
    I think i am a little shocked at some of the responses, because i am wondering if I am in a different USA than everyone else. I think it's foolish to believe that there isn't something desparately wrong with the portion of black men dating white women, particularly in comparison with other cultures. That isn't simply love or as people love to cling to "preferences." Yes, we all have preferences, but the motives behind those preferences are what makes those preferences DAMAGING.

    Jill spoke truth...period. I co-sign with others who have said, date a white woman if you like but don't claim it's because there is something wrong with black women and that seems to be the most popular mantra that does affect our reputations socially and professionally. I mean that's racism if i ever heard of it, internal racism which is just disheartening. Do you know how embarrasing it is at work when other white women and men and all other cultures ask me "why don't black men date black women". I mean how do you answer that? I come up with some politically correct answer that sounds nice. ARGH! It's easy to say, I don't want one of those kind of men anyway but the issue here is "those kind of men" are the "ideal black men" that many of use were raised to marry and they are quickly becoming a strong majority.

    There is a problem. I don't think pointing out the issue makes you bitter it makes you aware; and it isn't until you at least aware that you can promote positive changes.
    "We Live From the Head Down and Not the Feet Up" ~Donnie

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